Sorry friend, but it’s time to let this one go: https://www.snopes.com/news/2024/11/21/stephen-spoonamore-letter-harris/
Remember that we’re not like the Republicans - when confronted with claims of election tampering, we check whether the claims actually hold water, and it appears that they don’t.
Better spend your effort on figuring out how to get better results next election.
you are either being disingenuous or wildly uninformed.
Iit’s okay if you don’t like that one scientist. because there are dozens of other computer security experts who have come to the same conclusion, that since Trump’s lawyers admitted to hiring people to steal voting software used by 90% of voters in swing states, manual recounts should be implemented.
The Republicans have zero evidence of election interference.
democrats have straight up factual evidence of ballot, interference and electoral fraud.
do you know about how W won the 2004 election?
do you know about the fake elector scheme 4 years ago?
have you ever heard of gerrymandering?
voter poll purging?
Republican ballot interference has happened every election for decades, and it looks like it happened on a wider scale this time.
Iit’s okay if you don’t like that one scientist. because there are dozens of other computer security experts who have come to the same conclusion, that since Trump’s lawyers admitted to hiring people to steal voting software used by 90% of voters in swing states, manual recounts should be implemented.
Feel free to source it with concrete probable claims that have been verified by reputable sources.
I think manual counting should be the norm - all votes are counted manually in my country - but it’s unlikely that you will be able to get anyone to actually pull the trigger without concrete evidence of interference.
The Republicans have zero evidence of election interference.
Agreed.
democrats have straight up factual evidence of ballot, interference and electoral fraud.
Post it, then.
do you know about how W won the 2004 election?
I know how the 2000 election got stolen by Bush, but I’m not aware of the same thing happening in 2004. Feel free to fill in details.
do you know about the fake elector scheme 4 years ago?
Yes. It was never put into practice. Trump did try to institute a coup, but failed.
have you ever heard of gerrymandering?
Yes, this is a well-known example of legal election interference. Hand-counts won’t help in this case.
voter poll purging?
Same here
Republican ballot interference has happened every election for decades, and it looks like it happened on a wider scale this time.
Instances of legal election interference are not proof of illegal election interference occurring.
do you know about how W won the 2004 election?
He got more votes than Kerry, winning the popular vote (unlike his first election)
this was because the Kerry campaign failed to meet the moment, running an “I could run this war better” pro-war campaign.
This isn’t (and has never been) a democracy because the power is not with the people, institutions like the supreme court, the electoral college, the Senate, and the allocation of representatives make sure of that.
sure, kind of.
that all obligly agrees with what I’ve been saying.
you finally read some of those sources?
I’m very pro better late than never, good on you.
in the future, I’d appreciate it if you read things you comment on first before making claims based on assumptions.
have a good one
I didn’t find any of the arguments compelling, I’m just not particularly enchanted by this electoral system because it’s a fig leaf for a bourgeois dictatorship, and has been for some time. Just because you vote doesn’t mean it’s a democracy.
My position is that the fix has been in for a lot longer, there’s been basically no US presidents that have actually represented the entire population, it’s always businesses and settlers first (hence all the wars)
as long as you’re choosing to be in that system, the will of the electorate should be exerted to its side host when choosing their president.
the alternative you are suggesting is that because there are outsized special interests influencing you a selection, people shouldn’t have any say.
which I cannot agree with.
it’s a popular, simple opinion, doesn’t require you to do anything but it certainly doesn’t change anything for the better or have any positive benefits.
nobody’s arguing that the fix you’re talking about isn’t in, those computer scientists and I agree that we should try to fix the fix.
the alternative you are suggesting is that because there are outsized special interests influencing you a selection, people shouldn’t have any say.
No, I’m saying that they never had a say, and you’re imagining popular power that never existed. For most of the US existence only white men could vote for one, the franchise was eventually extended but any influence voting has always been overdetermined by the existence of the electoral college.
The fixating on a few times the election didn’t go your way just looks like nursing bruised egos instead of focusing on productive work and developing a better understanding of our politics.
Regardless of the outsized influence special interests have, Americans have had and still have a say in who they elect.
you are fixating on how difficult change is instead of understanding that things perpetually change and it’s the fight to change systems that changes systems.
you’re fighting for futility, I’m advocating realistic change.
you might be bummed out because of the election results, but that’s no reason to stop making things better.
you’re still here and so is everybody else, and in the Cassandric words of steve Harwell,
“We could all use a little chaaaAAAnge”.
It literally hurts no one to do some audits to be sure. No whining or streaming “stolen election”…just audits in key places to make sure it is above board. Any argument against it is maga/CCP(.ml)/ork interference.
exactly.
it’s bizarre that manual ballot counts with oversight are not the norm, all they can do is establish what happened.
there’s no downside.
Easy enough to disprove. Do the hand recounts in the supposedly affected states. If those hand recounts aren’t done, there’s going to be a lot of progressives who spend the next four years looking as lunatic as the “stop the steal” people - with the difference being that there was a really easy way to disprove the lunacy that wasn’t used, whereas the “stop the steal” was disproven multiple times and even went to court repeatedly.
So, what I’m saying, just do the damn recount so we can put this thing to rest.
Nah, harris already threw in the towel. She will not call for a recount, i guarantee it.
I’m actually pissed off at the Democratic party about just rolling over.
If Harris won you’re damn sure we’d be flooded with “investigations”, “evidence”, lawsuits and recounts. The news would be flooded with it.
Once Trump won all that shit just disappeared even though the reds have been prepping to fight for months.
Harris had a shit ton of money donated to her campaign. Why not hire a shit ton of lawyers and set them loose??
So instead we’re going to have to listen to half-baked conspiracy theories for the next few years in addition to everything else. Gah!
i remember the gore voters in 2000 who insisted it had been stolen.
and it was.
Gore actually won the popular vote, unlike this time
gore would have won the electoral college if the supreme court hadn’t fucked it around. the recounts took time.
Enjoy chasing this down to disassociate with what’s going on in the country for the next 4 years. Looks comfy, like really comfy.
I may slip on a pair of [conspiracy theory] myself at some point!
We knew damn well that Trump and co. were preparing to attempt to steal the election if necessary. We knew and have been documenting that Trump and co. were installing and/or trying to install sympathetic election officials everywhere they could in the last 4 years. We know damn well that Trump and co. already tried to cheat in the last election, e.g. trying to get Brad Raffensperger to “find me 11,780 votes” in Georgia in 2020. We know that Trump and co. are fighting hard in court anywhere they can to have mail in ballots thrown out, e.g. in Pennsylvania. We know Trump sycophants have been setting fire to absentee ballot boxes. These are not the actions of a campaign expecting to win legitimately.
Even sitting here as a random largely uneducated chump on the internet, not even rising to the level of armchair expert, I can see that the latest election results need to be investigated and validated and verified as thoroughly as humanly possible, on every level, to find where – not if – Trump’s cronies cheated. Whether or not they cheated enough to actually affect the ultimate outcome if the election is less clear, but let’s not kid ourselves. The chances that this was a completely straight and honest election are, without a doubt, zero.
If Dickhead really did win after all that, then he won. But the process must be totally transparent. There is no other way for it to maintain any semblance of legitimacy.
Okay Q!
It’s funny when you can’t tell if a post is satire or serious but deranged.
Either way, Musk doesn’t have the skills required to do anything involving stealing or effecting the outcome of an election. Dude can’t even sway his own piss poor polls on Twitter.
