• MerryJaneDoe@lemmy.world
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    8 months ago

    Not a fair comparison.

    In a nutshell, you can’t directly replace gas power with electric power. Gotta have some sort of conversion. Gas is very portable and offers big bang. Solar generally needs to be generated on demand or stored. Then it needs to be transported. We can’t transport the solar power from Texas to Michigan the same way we can truck gas across state lines. The longer an electric line, the more power is lost.

    Another issue with this graphic is that it implies that solar panels are a one-time expense. This isn’t true. They generally last about 20 years.

    I’m a champion of green energy, but a stickler for details.

  • EatMyPixelDust@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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    8 months ago

    You still need petrochemicals for the material refining and production process of solar cells. They’re better, but not as amazing as some people seem to think.

    • TheTechnician27@lemmy.world
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      8 months ago

      This is dead wrong (edit: kind of; see below). The dollars per million BTU for natural gas this February was $3.62, or 32% of the figure cited in the infographic. You’re thinking of oil.

      Solar is clearly more sustainable, economical, independent, and most importantly livable than LNG, but I still need to call out flawed assumptions on my side where I see them.


      Edit: I actually have no idea how this infographic reached its $11 assumption. Wholesale prices for natural gas were $4.88 per MMBtu in 2024. Emphasis on “wholesale”, but since this infographic doesn’t deign to cite any sources other than “Ember” (this Ember?), I have no idea what figure it means.


      Edit 2: After doing way too much digging into how global LNG prices are measured because this infographic barely even leaves breadcrumbs, they might’ve been using a metric like the JKMc1 (“LNG Japan/Korea Marker PLATTS Future”) (edit 3: or the TFAc1). The prices of natural gas (transported via pipeline) and LNG (transported via ship) are going to be quite different, and there’s no consistent “global average price” for LNG. The best you can really do is use some sort of proxy, for which it appears the JKMc1 is a reasonable one for reasons I don’t fully understand yet. That was approximately $11 in 2024 (it was actually seemingly higher, but close enough; probably close but separate figures) and was $10.73 this February. It was $15.92 March 1, showing at least in East Asia that LNG is about 50% more expensive than last month. I don’t know how well that applies to Lemmy’s predominantly American and European userbase, however (well, I know the US now supplies about 60% of Europe’s LNG and that American natural gas is currently cheaper).

      God, it’s so frustrating that this infographic barely cites anything. Anyway, to the person I responded to: you were at least somewhat right; the closing of the Strait seems to have clearly impacted East Asia… somehow. Iran and Qatar are the 3rd and 6th largest natural gas producers, respectively (no clue about LNG shipments), but I feel like I’ll end up with a doctoral thesis on the geopolitics of LNG prices by 2030 from knowing basically nothing if I don’t stop here. What all this does tell me is that an estimate of “global average price for LNG” means very little when prices per MMBtu (liquified or otherwise) seem to vary so heavily by region.

    • Barbarian@sh.itjust.works
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      8 months ago

      How do the solar panels generate constant fees?

      You see, people need to pay for electricity. Generally speaking, they don’t get it for free. Thus the owner of the solar panels makes money.

  • xxce2AAb@feddit.dk
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    8 months ago

    And with battery prices falling, the intermittency issues that made LNG useful despite the drawbacks is gradually becoming much less of a problem too.

  • Gladaed@feddit.org
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    8 months ago

    This is stupid, not because it’s untrue, but because you cannot manifest those solar panels out of thin air, or install them on a whim.

    Refueling existing infrastructure is trivial and expected.

    • Trainguyrom@reddthat.com
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      8 months ago

      Well then it’s a good thing that there’s a lot more than 2000 acres currently being used to grow varieties of corn that aren’t even intended for human consumption but will just be turned into ethanol