A bit ironic that a group labeling themselves the “Cookware Sustainability Alliance” is fighting to continue making unsustainable cookware.
Both the fact that they have a voice that influences politicians more than their actual voters and that they’re allowed to call themselves that name is really a perfect representation of society.
You can still get vintage Wagner cast iron for a decent price on eBay or FB marketplace, but over the past 15 years people have started to catch on to what I just mentioned. So it’s not as dirt cheap as it once was.
These days I generally know how to cook on a pitted lodge without it sticking, but smooth cast iron is more forgiving.
Got a few inherited from my grand and great grand parents, they’re amazing and perfect. Even got a cast iron muffin tin which is great for making Yorkshire puddings.
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Carbon steel and cast iron cookware have reactive metal surfaces that will rust if left exposed to moisture and air, especially when heated. To use these materials of cookware you need to season them which involves washing the surface clean and applying a very thin layer of oil which you then heat up to a high temperature (usually past the smoke point, but not strictly necessary).
The heating of oil in contact with the metal causes the oil molecules to polymerize and bond to the metal surface. Done properly, this gives your cast iron and carbon steel cookware a smooth, glassy, slightly brown protective polymer layer which prevents rust and helps foods release (though not as well as nonstick pans). The seasoning process can be repeated as many times as you like and it builds up more and more layers which darken over time. A well seasoned piece of cast iron or carbon steel cookware will look shiny and jet black, though this is not necessary for cooking.
The downside of these materials is that acidic or basic foods can damage the polymer layer and dissolve it right off the pan with enough heat and cooking time. Tomato sauce is a classic example of an acidic food that will eat away at the seasoning of a cast iron or carbon steel pan. A well seasoned pan can still be used to cook a tomato sauce, but not one you plan to be simmering for hours and hours (like some Sunday meat sauce like you’d see in Goodfellas).
Stainless steel (as well as enameled or porcelain coated) cookware is nonreactive so you can use it to cook acidic or basic foods no problem!
I thought there, who on earth makes tomato sauce in a non-stick pan 😅
Nice writeup btw!
So my stainless steel/inox Lagostina pan is non reactive? What would be the benefit from having a carbon steel one (I have used cast iron a lot but it’s so heavy)?
Exactly that: weight. Some people will give you other reasons why they like carbon steel but the most important is that it works like cast iron only lighter
Carbon steel is lighter but this also has less thermal mass, so it heats up and cools down faster, also tends to have less even heating.
So, searing something quickly on a preheated pan is a bit harder since the pan will cool off faster as the food leaches the heat out. Important for stuff like stir fry’s or steaks where you want short periods of intense heat for good searing at the surface but not over cooking in the interior.
Ohh right, I didn’t think about how acidic tomatoes are. I love tomatoes, but some of the people around me get absolutely horrible stomach pains apparently.
Anyway, we make tomato based sauces at home, but never have we simmered anything for several hours like that cooking scene in Goodfellas. Should I? Would it be significantly better?
I don’t want to cause a panic, but acids like tomato juice, ascorbic, citric and vinegar can attack stainless steel and dissolved chrome in the process.
But don’t think of it as extra chrome in your diet. After all, we get iron rich water from our cast iron pipes and fittings. Nah, think of it as that extra cancer you’re gonna be getting! Iron never gave you cancer, that’s a lousy metal. But chrome is pretty good!
Basically go to goodwill and have a look at their used stainless pans and then compare that to what you see at the store. Its not magic material. You put some tomatoes paste or salty beans or vinegar on it and you’ll be getting some chrome dissolved on to your food. Great! Its just a little right? Wrong! What else do you see? Scratches! Every time you use a metal spoon or steel wool to grab food or clean the pan, you create brand new unreacted leachable metal chrome…pans are probably grade 18 or 316 stainless steel, so 18% of whatever shavings you made becomes happy trivalent Cr-3 ions floating around with your tasty Na and CL lol. Look at pans that got overheated or pans where you accidentally left a spoon before going on vacation for a week…they’re black where some food was left on the surface due to oxygen depletion. Stainless steel is by no means the savior. Its the magic bullet, along with plastic in the food processing business! Processed foods pass thru churning mechanisms…metal rubbing and shedding stuff on to the food.
This is why I sleep at night. I’m basically a walking FEMA disaster zone, yet, I still somehow get to my 8hr enslavement work and then back to my rest of the day 2-3 hours worth of family disfunctions just fine.
TLDR: the tomato sauce (and other acidic fruits) reacts with the iron. Although properly seasoning (fat treating) your pan will ameliorate it, and humanity has used it for time immemorial. It does eat away some of the seasoning, leading to having to te season it, which can be annoying.
Carbon steel or cast iron all the way.
A bit ironic that a group labeling themselves the “Cookware Sustainability Alliance” is fighting to continue making unsustainable cookware.
Both the fact that they have a voice that influences politicians more than their actual voters and that they’re allowed to call themselves that name is really a perfect representation of society.
Available at a thrift store near you, with no carbon cost!
Buying thrift store cast iron is risky, it may have been used to melt lead.
Sorry if this is a dumb question, but why would you use it to melt lead?
https://www.theballisticassistant.com/turning-scrap-lead-into-a-resource/
Fair, but you can get a lead testing kit for around $10 USD.
Sigh, just when I thought I found a way to get a smooth frying pan, look in my comments, I litterarly just posted here…
Why would people melt lead in a frying pan?
Most often to make their own bullets.
Ah, but why in a frying pan?
Cheap, commonly available, convenient.
Used cast iron is usually better than a lot of new stuff. Back in the day, it was common for the pitted surfaces to be ground smooth.
Now you can only get that with some “premium brands” that are willing to take a grinder to a pan before throwing it in the box.
SO THAT IS WHY MY FRYING PAN IS ANNOYING!
I just thought it was going to be naturally ground down over time…
Damn it, now I gotta find a thrift store.
Or you can season the shit out of it. That will also smooth out the surface. Seasoning basically makes non-stick layers on your pan using burned oil.
Preferably outdoors wipe a thin film of cooking oil on the pan and heat it up till it smokes, leaves smokey for a bit, cool down and repeat.
It’d probably be smart to read real instructions somewhere else, but that’s the jist of it.
You can still get vintage Wagner cast iron for a decent price on eBay or FB marketplace, but over the past 15 years people have started to catch on to what I just mentioned. So it’s not as dirt cheap as it once was.
These days I generally know how to cook on a pitted lodge without it sticking, but smooth cast iron is more forgiving.
It starts getting better after 10 or so years when the seaaoning has built up to fill the surface roughness.
Or you sand it down to be smooth and reseason it.
Season it with Flax seed oil. Worth the $10 for the bottle, and time.
Cooks Country came up with Flax seed oil after a lot of testing.
http://www.cooksillustrated.com/how...d=26897&frtk=u3VJqn8v17q3E4m0demcX4pjog35T4sL
Oops, that link is expired!
Got a few inherited from my grand and great grand parents, they’re amazing and perfect. Even got a cast iron muffin tin which is great for making Yorkshire puddings.
Enameled cast iron is also great
Is this the ceramic coated ones?
https://prudentreviews.com/ceramic-vs-enameled-cookware/
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I have my browser configured to default to reader mode, and it seems readable
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I guess they don’t want our traffic then.
It’s unfortunate - I thought it was a fairly comprehensive and readable overview of the differences between enamel and ceramic coated
Costly but good
Stainless steel! Neither of those is something you want to use to simmer a tomato sauce.
Why’s that? I’ve never owned any of the 3, all pans have been some form of nonstick.
Carbon steel and cast iron cookware have reactive metal surfaces that will rust if left exposed to moisture and air, especially when heated. To use these materials of cookware you need to season them which involves washing the surface clean and applying a very thin layer of oil which you then heat up to a high temperature (usually past the smoke point, but not strictly necessary).
The heating of oil in contact with the metal causes the oil molecules to polymerize and bond to the metal surface. Done properly, this gives your cast iron and carbon steel cookware a smooth, glassy, slightly brown protective polymer layer which prevents rust and helps foods release (though not as well as nonstick pans). The seasoning process can be repeated as many times as you like and it builds up more and more layers which darken over time. A well seasoned piece of cast iron or carbon steel cookware will look shiny and jet black, though this is not necessary for cooking.
The downside of these materials is that acidic or basic foods can damage the polymer layer and dissolve it right off the pan with enough heat and cooking time. Tomato sauce is a classic example of an acidic food that will eat away at the seasoning of a cast iron or carbon steel pan. A well seasoned pan can still be used to cook a tomato sauce, but not one you plan to be simmering for hours and hours (like some Sunday meat sauce like you’d see in Goodfellas).
Stainless steel (as well as enameled or porcelain coated) cookware is nonreactive so you can use it to cook acidic or basic foods no problem!
I thought there, who on earth makes tomato sauce in a non-stick pan 😅
Nice writeup btw!
So my stainless steel/inox Lagostina pan is non reactive? What would be the benefit from having a carbon steel one (I have used cast iron a lot but it’s so heavy)?
Any community you’d recommend?
Exactly that: weight. Some people will give you other reasons why they like carbon steel but the most important is that it works like cast iron only lighter
A well seasoned carbon steel is pretty much non-stick while in a stainless you usually want some sticking to have something to deglaze for sauces.
Mine sticks enough for a nice sauce :-) !
Carbon steel is lighter but this also has less thermal mass, so it heats up and cools down faster, also tends to have less even heating.
So, searing something quickly on a preheated pan is a bit harder since the pan will cool off faster as the food leaches the heat out. Important for stuff like stir fry’s or steaks where you want short periods of intense heat for good searing at the surface but not over cooking in the interior.
Ohh right, I didn’t think about how acidic tomatoes are. I love tomatoes, but some of the people around me get absolutely horrible stomach pains apparently.
Anyway, we make tomato based sauces at home, but never have we simmered anything for several hours like that cooking scene in Goodfellas. Should I? Would it be significantly better?
Oh you’ve got no idea how good tomato sauce can get then! It’s also great for making huge batches so you freeze most of it for later.
Hmmmm I have some bad ideas now, thanks!
I don’t want to cause a panic, but acids like tomato juice, ascorbic, citric and vinegar can attack stainless steel and dissolved chrome in the process.
But don’t think of it as extra chrome in your diet. After all, we get iron rich water from our cast iron pipes and fittings. Nah, think of it as that extra cancer you’re gonna be getting! Iron never gave you cancer, that’s a lousy metal. But chrome is pretty good!
https://theproperkitchen.com/do-stainless-steel-pans-leach-into-food/
Yes and no, apparently.
Basically go to goodwill and have a look at their used stainless pans and then compare that to what you see at the store. Its not magic material. You put some tomatoes paste or salty beans or vinegar on it and you’ll be getting some chrome dissolved on to your food. Great! Its just a little right? Wrong! What else do you see? Scratches! Every time you use a metal spoon or steel wool to grab food or clean the pan, you create brand new unreacted leachable metal chrome…pans are probably grade 18 or 316 stainless steel, so 18% of whatever shavings you made becomes happy trivalent Cr-3 ions floating around with your tasty Na and CL lol. Look at pans that got overheated or pans where you accidentally left a spoon before going on vacation for a week…they’re black where some food was left on the surface due to oxygen depletion. Stainless steel is by no means the savior. Its the magic bullet, along with plastic in the food processing business! Processed foods pass thru churning mechanisms…metal rubbing and shedding stuff on to the food.
This is why I sleep at night. I’m basically a walking FEMA disaster zone, yet, I still somehow get to my 8hr enslavement work and then back to my rest of the day 2-3 hours worth of family disfunctions just fine.
Aw man…
TLDR: the tomato sauce (and other acidic fruits) reacts with the iron. Although properly seasoning (fat treating) your pan will ameliorate it, and humanity has used it for time immemorial. It does eat away some of the seasoning, leading to having to te season it, which can be annoying.
Sure, or enamelled cast iron.
I just use a aluminum pan. It doesn’t really matter if it heats evenly since you are making a liquid.
Aluminum is reactive too. But it tends to hold onto a seasoning really well!
Not necessarily. You can by pans with a polished surface.