I saw a post that talked about racism towards people and when I talked about it the response I got was very heated and a person even called lemmy.world a community of ‘hitlerites’
I have been around for a week or so and this is my first time seeing such explicit vulgar reaction towards another community, is this a one-off or should I block hexbear?
A self help group for people who struggle with solvent abuse.
Hexbear is cool. I’ve learned a lot from them. the thing is, some of the people there can be a little brash at first. I recommend looking around the instance a bit before you decide on blocking it. some of them can be a little brash but they mean well.
This is an extremely reasonable take, not sure why anyone would downvote you for it other than tribalism.
You found it, the answer is tribalism.
Hexbear has proven so many times to be completely unreasonable that it isn’t worth wading through that much toxicity to find the good parts.
I have not had that experience, at all. If anything I’ve had that experience on .world.
if anything, they are just proving them right about their instance. but it is what it is, there will always be tribalism on the internet and in the world.
I would block hexbear. I’ve done it server-wide. They are mostly very loud trolls pretending to be communists. Some could be actual communists, but I don’t buy anyone actually wanting to be in such a toxic environment and believe what they claim to believe.
To add to your comment: Blocking the instance at user level is pointless, it only blocks their posts,not their users, so you still have to deal with their bullshit and they post their propaganda at every instance that tolerates them so it makes its way to those who blocked it anyway.
The only solution is to defederate.User blocking also doesn’t block votes so they’ll also still influence your feed.
They’re “communist” if you believe that supporting the CCP is “communist” and that the usa is “capitalist”. It’s all just political tribalism to them, that’s why they are also anti-Liberal and at times very anti-Democracy. The actual definitions of any of these political identities is completely lost on them, all of these words only mean west or east to them.
You either block them and die a liberal or you engage and observe and live long enough to start spreading their agitprop and using your new pronoun “comrade” as you lead the way to glorious revolution.
(Seriously though, they’re just people on a leftist political instance. You’ll get the good, bad, and weird, same as any other place).
Hexbear.net is a Left-Unity instance populated mainly by Marxists and Anarchists. They generally don’t get along with Lemmy.world, whose admins defederated from the major Marxist-aligned instances.
Whether you block Hexbear is up to you, I enjoy my time there a lot but it’s also because I’m a Marxist. The ones saying they are “pretending” to be Leftist never seem to be able to explain why a large group of people would all ironically have theory reading groups and ironically support trans rights for years, even before federating with anyone else. What would they have to gain?
If I were you, I’d ask on an instance actually federated with them. You’ll get different perspectives than you will here, which is always the case when it comes to controversial topics like Marxism, where opinion varies greatly from instance to instance.
Left-Unity instance
I doubt it or I’d be over there. Instead, I got attacked and mocked by a circlejerking mob of angsty teens from Hexbear operating in bad faith for remotely questioning something about communism and then got permabanned from Lemmy.ml. I didn’t even attack it! 😂
Remember that they don’t consider liberals to be leftists
Do you have a link? Would be interested to see.
Credit where credit is due, youre honest and youre correct. Have my upvote!
I try to be both, lol. Thanks!
The reason they got defederated from so many major instances is less to do with the politics and more to do with the spam, brigading, and bad faith interactions that had no intention of civility.
You can tell someone is terminally reddit brained when they’re still accusing people from federated instances of “brigading”.
This is objectively untrue, Lemmy.world refused to ever federate, as, in their own words, a “pre-emptive last resort”.
In their statement, the reasoning they explicitly highlighted was Hexbear’s stances like being against western propaganda and disliking the mass overseas wars driven by the US. Don’t believe me? You can read it here - https://lemmy.world/post/2498330
So no, Hexbear was very explicitly defederated because of politics.
The world mods also outright support Israel.
The issue with hexbear isn’t Marxism or anarchism or communism, it’s apologism for violent authoritarian regimes to the point of insisting on an “alternative facts” version of “history”.
Alternative facts is when you refuse to admit you were wrong after carrying water for a single source white supremacist even when all the major media platforms that boosted the claim dropped it years ago.
So for years, as a ‘good leftist’, you continue repeating blood libel while you scream at people to support a capitalist committing genocide.
I really can’t tell what you are talking about.
Adrian Zenz
I really don’t think they are a left-unity instance considering that they get very upset and unpleasant to talk to if you don’t support authoritarianism or their alternative “facts.”
Like I’m cool with all sorts of different leftist viewpoints and I think it’s necessary that we support each other, but I draw the line at authoritarianism and rewriting history.
Anarchists are explicitly welcome, so authoritarianism is definitely not a requirement. And what “alternative facts”?
Things like the denial of the tiananmen square massacre or claiming that North Korea is a free and prosperous nation, both of which I have seen with my own two eyes on hexbear.
While I am not an anarchist, generally I am cool with them. Who I am not cool with are Marxist-Leninists, which are authoritarian.
From the wikipedia article on Marxist-Leninists:
In the words of historians Silvio Pons and Robert Service, elections are “generally not competitive, with voters having no choice or only a strictly limited choice”. Generally, when alternative candidates have been allowed to stand for election, they have not been allowed to promote very different political views.
The people of the soviet union, at least as far as Pat Sloan experienced in ~1937, had the most limited choice: any person
I have, while working in the Soviet Union, participated in an election. I, too, had a right to vote, as I was a working member of the community, and nationality and citizenship is no bar to electoral rights. The procedure was extremely simple. A general meeting of all the workers in our organization was called by the trade union committee, candidates were discussed, and a vote was taken by show of hands. Anybody present had the right to propose a candidate, and the one who was elected was not personally a member of the Party. In considering the claims of the candidates their past activities were discussed, they themselves had to answer questions as to their qualifications, anybody could express an opinion, for or against them, and the basis of all the discussion was: What justification had the candidates to represent their comrades on the local Soviet?
As far as the elections in the villages were concerned, these took place at open village meetings, all peasants of voting age, other than those who employed labour, having the right to vote and to stand for election. As in the towns, any organization or individual could put forward candidates, anyone could ask the candidate questions, and anybody could support or oppose the candidature. It is usual for the Communist Party to put forward a candidate, trade unions and other organizations can also do so, and there is nothing to prevent the Party’s candidate from not being elected, if he has not sufficient prestige among the voters.Several things in there I dislike:
Raising hands does not seem like an accurate way vote. Peasants who employed labor couldn’t vote. People could vote even if they weren’t citizens. No mention of being able to vote for non-communists. There are trade-unions and other candidates but it doesn’t mention their political alignment
To defend non-citizens voting, the Soviets valued labor over nationalism and anyone could vote despite not being citizens if they worked there. Kinda like if the US allowed immigrants to vote who weren’t yet citizens.
Trade Unions were often independent as well. Really, the book itself is fascinating.
I support immigration but allowing non-citizens to vote seems like an easy way for foreign governments to swing elections in their favor.
Yes, I get that the trade unions were their own thing but that doesn’t mean they can’t also be communist.
No mention of being able to vote for non-communists
???
Anybody present had the right to propose a candidate, the one who was elected was not personally a member of the Party
???
I don’t really understand what you’re getting at here, you’re being very vague. I’m a Marxist, I enjoy my time there, I don’t really think I can say I share your same views on it.
When the instance I’m on was still federated with hexbear I did go and check them out to see what they had to say and with my own two eyes I saw people there denying the tiananmen square massacre and claiming that North Korea is a free and prosperous nation. Not to mention that when visiting other instances, such as the one I’m on, many would be extremely rude, which is why they got defederated.
Hexbear’s stance, and most Marxists in general, on Tian’anmen is that hundreds of protestors and PLA officers were killed in Beijing that day as the PLA advanced towards the square, but that the square itself was evacuated peacefully, which matches leaked US cables and the CPC’s official stance on what it calls the “June 4th incident”. This is a rejection of the commonly reported story of 10,000 people being killed on the square itself, which originated from a British diplomat’s cable. Said diplomat was later confirmed to have evacuated well before.
I reiterate, Hexbear’s stance isn’t that the massacre didn’t happen, but that Western nations intentionally sensationalize the quantity of deaths and the character of the events. This is also why Western Nations don’t frequently report on the South Korean Gwang-Ju massacre that occured around the same era, where the South Korean millitary murdered thousands of High School and College students protesting against Chun Do-Hwan’s dictatorship. All of what I said is backed up by the Wikipedia page for Tian’anmen Square Protests and Massacre, such as Alan Donald revising his estimate from 10,000 to the low thousands yet BBC continuing to report the 10,000 figure:
In a disputed cable sent in the aftermath of the events at Tiananmen, British Ambassador Alan Donald initially claimed, based on information from a “good friend” in the State Council of China, that a minimum of 10,000 civilians died,[237] claims which were repeated in a speech by Australian Prime Minister Bob Hawke,[238] but which is an estimated number much higher than other sources provided.[239][240] After the declassification, former student protest leader Feng Congde pointed out that Donald later revised his estimate to 2,700–3,400 deaths, a number closer to, but still much higher than, other estimates.[241]
As for the DPRK, I’d have to see what you mean as an example. The common consensus is that the DPRK has a well-documented “defector storytelling industry” where defectors are paid for outlandish stories, and due to their unverifiability gets passed on as truth. A good documentary on this subject is Loyal Citizens of Pyongyang in Seoul. Therefore, really, very little can be trusted on the subject. Brutal executions being reported such as one official being eaten to death by 120 dogs end up being reported uncritically, despite said official turning up alive later and the story originating from a Chinese satirical column, akin to the Onion.
This is where the joke of “Juche Necromancy” comes from, because supposedly executed officials regularly turn up alive.
Tankies
It’s an instance meant to seem attractive to western youths while explicitly only serving the needs of the Chinese Dictatorship.
Most of their users are bots, human decency is their kryptonite. If ever you are convinced that any of them are your friends, you’re just another mark they intend to make full use of and throw away: you are not a human being in the eyes of Hexbear.
I’ll do you one better, why is Hexbear??
It’s an instance that became known for brigading other instances to “dunk” on anyone who has remotely different ideas than they do, as well as spamming oversized emojis and pictures of pigs shitting on their own testicles. They have been defederated by most instances for good reason, as they always showed up enmasse to completely derail discussion and their own stated purpose of federating with other instances was to “dunk on liberals and dismantle Western propaganda”. Their users would harass people in DMs for weeks on end if that person said something they didn’t like. I was there to see this happen in several instances before they all defederated from Hexbear and it almost made me quit Lemmy entirely.
Below are some examples of various instances considering federating with Hexbear, only for Hexbesr’s users to cause enough problems to get defederated. The threads themselves are best viewed from an instance that federates with Hexbear in order to see the awful behaviour for yourself, and the lemmy.ca thread has several more examples of this.
https://lemmy.ca/post/3326347 https://lemm.ee/post/4543536 https://lemmy.blahaj.zone/post/2017079 https://lemmy.world/post/249833
Do note that a lot of Hexbear users have alternate accounts on lemmy.ml and midwest.social (because nobody wants to federate with Hexbear), and a lot of these people will be in this very thread trying to defend Hexbear. Don’t be fooled by them. Hexbear is a toxic cesspit.
Hexbear is a different instance where its users are basically a group of hard communism supporters. If you disliked their behavior, feel free to block their instance.
They are not only hard communists, they have 0 interest in propagating their ideas, they only insult and despise everyone who is not 100% in agreement with them. In the best case, and I don’t think it is, it is an endogamous community only for themselves, the opposite of what a federated social network is
“tankie” here, dont really support them, they are the reason the left cant unify and are constantly infighting
Their entire stated purpose of federating is to “dunk” on people and “dismantle Western propaganda”. They’re not interested in participating in good faith and never have been. They don’t see anyone who disagrees with them as a person, just something to yell at and harass.
Note: being on Lemmy for about a year, I didn’t live through the early days of this place. Here’s what I can recollect, as neutrally given as possible.
TL;DR The recent conflicts between two politically different groups on Lemmy have radicalized many people, and many Hexbear residents in particular. Unless you are to discuss the far-left ideas and are very radical about disadvantaged groups, you are safe to block it.
Hexbear is a far-left (as in actually communist) anti-discrimination community, initially more of a safe haven to promote equality and foster a healthy and welcoming place for leftists to come together.
With core developers of Lemmy also being far-left, Hexbear naturally fitted the landscape along with the official Lemmy.ml, heavy far-left Lemmygrad.ml and others.
As time went on, however, all sorts of left-leaning and apolitical folks, not just far-left, came to the platform, filling other instances like Lemmy.world (now the most populated of them all), sh.itjust.works and many others.
As a result, Lemmy has two groups of people with radically different political views: one is a group of more or less organized far-left, and the other is everyone else, most commonly liberals. This distinction has caused a lot of conflicts and heated discussions based on political adherence.
Most notable case is latest US elections. The far left side generally called not to vote Democrat as Biden has failed to deliver on many of his promises and empowered Israel to commit war crimes in Palestine, while the liberal audience called to vote Democrat to not let Republicans take the lead, which may arguably lead to an even worse outcome than unaccountable Dems can make.
This divide has raised a lot of mutual hostility, brigading, and uncivil behavior, which has radicalized many on both sides of the conflict, the consequences of which you have got to experience.
What to do with that is up to you to decide. Hexbear is very politically uniform and very political overall, so if you’re not here to discuss communism, you won’t lose much and will gain additional peace of mind.
Also Hexbear and Lemmygrad were populated by r/chapotraphouse and r/GenZedong users respectively when those subreddits got banned, which happened before the main Reddit exodus that populated instances like .world
I’m being a little pedantic here, but “far left (as in actually communist)” wasn’t a thing until these recent online debates and forming groups started putting labels on groups and putting them into boxes. Communists are not necessarily left, nor far left. It feels a bit weird to ‘put’ them anywhere. That said, I know nothing about hexbear or this little group on Lemmy and how they identify…
What do you believe “leftism” means? I can’t see a world where an ideology based on public ownership, collectivization, and working class liberation could be seen not as left.
A label, in all honesty. Historically they’re not left nor right nor middle. They can have ideologies of many, but too long to get into here. I was being pedantic because it’s a slight bug of mine when they are labelled and boxed like that. For example Nikolai Bukharin and Alexei Rykov (Bukharinists) and others like Joseph Stalin were not considered left but were communist.
Bukharin was considered “right” from the standpoint of a far-left ideology, as a point of comparison to the standard party line. That’s like saying -5 is a positive number because it is closer to positive numbers than -10.
Bro tf?
communists are on the left, not sure the page you linked is making the case for anything other than American political scientists being extremely unserious
Cold War brain rot just ruined a generation of thought. My dad was a never-Trumper that called Trump a communist.
Uh no? Also your linked book page doesn’t fit your argument.
It is unclear what this excerpt is meant to demonstrate.
By default, the terms “left” and “right” are describing the level of economic equality/freedom in a given society. The left call for economic equality and redistribution of resources, either through peaceful cooperation and abundance or through heavy state intervention, the right stands for private property above equality and freedom to act in personal financial interest.
Communists hold economic equality as paramount and vital for society, and put it above all else; in a perfect communist world, everyone always has access to everything that is available in an economy, and as such, there is no money (you can already take anything you need) and no point to privatize anything as there’s no revenue to speak of.
Thereby, communism is far left.
I assume the rest of it would explain how Stalinism created an economic and social heirarchy at express odds with real Marxism but that still leaves you with real communists being the left. The author is ultimately crying about humanity’s insistence that words mean things and trying to take the word communist away from communists.
This is by far the best and most informative answer. The only thing it’s missing as another couple commenters pointed out is hexbear is all about their oversized memes and emojis, making anytime you happen upon one of their posts extremely conspicuous (even if politics aren’t being discussed).
The oversized emoji bug was fixed, by the way. They display normally now on other instances.
Its a leftist space that sometimes has trolls
“Sometimes” is an understatement. Their entire purpose for federating with other instances is to attack and “dunk” on anyone who remotely disagrees with them.
They mandate trigger warnings for pictures of cheese.
Base line Lemmy has a left skew. Hexbear people are the basis for probably a quarter of conservatives talking points.
Oh another one of these
Short answer:
“What if 4chan was communist instead of neonazi”
Similar level of assholety and low post quality. Better politics. Overall don’t bother, not worth it.
lmao the blatant transphobia “disengage with the largest trans safe space on lemmy”
you’re so obvious
even if one assumes your trollish comment was in good faith, it only takes a single glance at hexbears front page to see it’s filled with kindness and reason. just people having fun online while still making space for serious discussion. and again, making sure marginalized people are safe and welcome. I wonder what your real issue with the site is?
seriously, what other site allows trans people to safely and comfortably be ourselves like this? https://hexbear.net/post/4271750
There is literally nothing transphohic about their comment, what the hell are you on about? People don’t like Hexbear because it’s trans-friendly, people dislike it because of their tankie politics and users that act like edgy 14 year olds.
There’s 7 featured posts, which I assume are stickies made by the moderators. The 3rd post after that, so the 3rd actual popular post, is “fucking libs are still making excuses in the comments”. Such kindness and reason …
Funny how you don’t say anything about what that post is actually about - it’s about redditors excusing Kamala’s support for Israel. They aren’t kind to you if you defend the mass slaughter of civilians, no.
It seems to me that showing equal kindness to oppressor and oppressed would be supporting the oppressor.
Deragotory language, generalization & stigmatization. It is hate speech against all liberal minded people, there is nothing kind or reasonable about it.
Hate speech? Is “lib” a slur now? Are liberals a protected class? It’s not “hate speech” it’s just criticism of a political position.
“A pejorative word, phrase, slur, or derogatory term is a word or grammatical form expressing a negative or disrespectful connotation, a low opinion, or a lack of respect toward someone or something.[1] It is also used to express criticism, hostility, or disregard.”
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pejorative
So yes, it’s a slur.
Lmao. Guess we better update the slur filter to remove all instances of the word “lib.” Sorry, am I allowed to say it in quotes like that, or is it too offensive? I wouldn’t want to offend your delicate lib sensibilities.
To be clear, If you truly believe lib is a slur, then you also believe “tankie” is a slur but is justified.
Rather than making a silly argument equating pejoratives for political positions being equal to slurs based on immutable characteristics, you could just not do that.
Literally got banned from a world com for using “lib” as a slur. Honestly, they’re not a protected class but they’re such idiots post election loss that it might as well be a slur. They have zero self reflection and are blaming everybody but themselves for the landslide loss of the presidency, the house, the senate, state and local government positions. Everyone else just voted wrong and hates minorities you see.
Tank goes vroooooommm.
Nobody mentioned blahaj broski
when i used blahaj i was harassed by transphobic chasers. it is NOT a safe space.
Better politics.
The same way getting stabbed is better than taking a round of buckshot.
Flashback three months and you were supporting a genocide
Bullshit.
“What if 4chan was communist instead of neonazi”
Not quite, that would be /leftypol/
Better politics.
This reminds me of one of their site banners:
Hexbear has its origins on Reddit’s ChapoTrapHouse which I’m pretty sure has a connection to leftypol in its history.
But sure
My point is:
Hexbear = Jerkoffs, except class conscious
Would be nice if they weren’t jerkoffs but hey, at least they have class consciousness.
This analysis isn’t quite accurate. On the whole, Hexbear is actually one of the kindest and coolest and community-minded places I’ve ever been on the internet. But I’d agree there’s an issue of a portion of users who happily get overly aggro if you annoy them (and being allowed to get away with it).
Hexbear is pretty overwhelmingly queer/trans and anarchist/communist.
If you’ve never run into a transfem communist IRL it’s probably because you’re not in many queer or left wing organizing spaces.
I’m actually pretty new to Lemmy in the last year and in that time I’ve seen way more .world posters being toxic about .ml/hexbear and making vague posts about how bad they are. I have to imagine that’s why you’re now seeing backlash to .world. Also most of the time I see people complaining about these instances and I dig into the modlog it’s overwhelmingly because they got banned at some point for being reactionary and are bent out of shape about it.
In my experience as a queer leftist, world is toxic as hell. I’ve had numerous moments where I’ve considered banning the whole instance but there’s communities on it I like. So i ban individuals who drink too much liberal kool aid and think team blue can do nothing wrong and genocide is perfectly reasonable because the other guy is worse! and they have been crying non stop since they lost and continue to blame the left for having a backbone rather than look in the mirror.
Needless to say my whole account got banned on world for being a Luigi supporter and anti-democrat. So im on an anarchist instance now, and even after a minor disagreement with an admin over the concept of copyright it’s still nice.
We disagreed on copyright?! That’s a ben, landlubber!
It had to do with AI training on data (individual peoples artwork for example) without permission.
I don’t care about corporate stuff being stolen but individual artists getting screwed doesn’t sit well with me. And it’s the one and only time I’ve ever said nice things about adobe of all companies! because they compensate artists who’s work they train their ai on.
Guess I’m gonna have to change instances again lololol (please don’t ban me I like it here)
I was clearly joking! all good!
deleted by creator
ITT: everyone says they’re bad without giving any examples, telling you what to think instead of letting you form your own conclusions.
They’re decent people as long as you don’t argue politics with them… I think
It truly depends on your own political views. What do you consider yourself?
Sometimes I like hexbear, agree with them and laugh with them, and sometimes their insular attitude makes me cringe. I am very critical of the democratic establishment in the US but hexbear’s “blueMAGA” talk is really offputting to me and sounds like the incel / redpill speak from parts of reddit and other online communities.
Given the liberal meltdown post election and inability to self reflect about the landslide loss, blue MAGA is entirely fitting.
“I’ll be glad when they all get deported or end up in camps, serves them right for being anti-genocide single issue voters.”
Totally rational statement.
Define Blue Maga for me, I haven’t seen a consistent explanation.
Anyone who thinks its the people that fail the party and not the other way around. So basically anyone who blames the people for not voting dem, instead of blaming the dems for not putting forth an appealing program that would represent the voters. You know, like in a democracy.
MAGA is a movement that glorifies a Hitler like figure who has promised to put tens of millions of honest workers in concentration camps because somehow immigrants are the cause of all their woes. These folks were both willing to deny any loss for any reason and willing to kill their neighbors in a civil war to “take their county back” if they lose.
“bluemaga” are people what mad that America’s Hitler won?
Blue MAGA is the cult like belief that the democrats can do nothing wrong and any criticism of them is a vote for trump. It’s idiotic, just like their red MAGA counterparts. They’re willing to accept a genocide so long as their team wins.
Blue maga is a stupid stupid term by stupid stupid people
You’re just mad because it’s about you. What’s stupid is thinking voting blue no matter who being a winning strategy. That worked out for ya didn’t it. Lost the presidency, the senate, the house, numerous state governments and local elections. Great job liberals! You’d rather lose to fascists than embrace leftist positions.
bluemaga were coming to the defense of Genocide Joe until the very last second and the only thing that made them switch was a bad TV performance. They didn’t care about the genocide, it was a bad TV performance that made them go “uuuh not a good look sweaty” and then they started rooting for the genocides second-in-command. They’re mad Hitler won because they were rooting for Mussolini
They’re mad Hitler won because they were rooting for Mussolini
Damn what a fucking burn right there. But they’ll still never get what the problem is, because they’re liberals and so long as the west keeps delivering treats to the well off coastal suburban liberal base the democrats can do nothing wrong. Genocide? What genocide? Trump will be worse! meanwhile trumps getting a ceasefire in place (which granted who knows if Israel will actually follow or if everyone’s full of shit) with the same conditions as the one biden offered months ago, only this time yahoo is agreeing to it. Liberal talking points aging like milk so far.
And for the record, I voted third party, and I’ll continue to drink liberal tears. The democrats would rather lose to a fascist than adopt leftist positions.
But they’ll still never get what the problem is, because they’re liberals and so long as the west keeps delivering treats to the well off coastal suburban liberal base the democrats can do nothing wrong.
I remember this comment https://lemmy.world/comment/10079489 because it’s such a good view into the average treatler brain. They believe Trump would be good for them but out of the kindness of their hearts they’re willing to sacrifice some imagined treats and those ethnicities better be grateful for it.
Worse moderation than Reddit subs. Will ban any views that don’t fit their narratives. Just got a server wide ban for giving links showing how the ceasefire was reached by promising the right wing factions more of the West Bank as Trumps largest donor intended.
You know mod logs on Hexbear are public, right? It’s very, very clear that “giving links” is not why you were banned.
Yes I’m aware. Please quote or link whatever you think is ban worthy. Nice alt btw.
ITT: the example is in the past and OP is asking why they’re bad.
If there’s no link it’s not an example it’s an anecdote.
