So I’ve been looking at upgrading my PC and it looks like I can get a better “micro” pc than my current (ancient) desktop for significantly less money than a full blown gaming rig. An example of such a rig is this.
I don’t have high gaming requirements - I play mostly old games, I think the newest games I play are from 5+ years ago.
What reasons are there for not buying one of these (over a comparable “proper” desktop)?
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You are FAR better off buying a used gaming rig than a mini PC…
Those boxes have heat issues, are not at all user-servicable, and really are only designed as a web browser box.
Great for media players / HTPCs, attrpcious for trying to game on.
Buy a 5 year old gaming system
If your tight on money, building a system will always come out on top in the long term, specifically in terms of upgrade paths to keep up with the times. In that mini pc you won’t have any upgrade option except maybe swapping the SSD, and not even this is guaranteed - could be soldered on too. So the only thing you can do is replace the whole thing again, having the full cost again.
Get yourself a mainboard, a nice Ryzen CPU, an dedicated GPU, 32 Gigs of RAM and an NVME drive, a Case and PSU your done.
I’ve done the works for you and slapped together an entry level gaming pc with lots of upgradeability:
https://geizhals.at/wishlists/4654924
This system is expandable in every way:
- The Cpu is on an current AM5 socket and you can upgrade whenever it starts to be the bottleneck
- You can simply double the ram when you decide to, but 32 GB is fine for now
- The PSU is decently sized and should support pretty much every sensible upgrade, just have an eye on it if upgrading the GPU
- The Mainboard has a lot of M.2 slots available to add more fast disk space and you can add sata disks in addition
- The Case has cable management, place for 2 hdds for tons of storage if needed and good connectivity (usb3, usb-c, audio, sdcard)
- The GPU is fast enough for current titles in 1080p, and older titles should run on 1440p too.
Disclaimer: i don’t know where you are so i took that graphics card because it’s a good price here and has nice performance without burning a hole in your purse, ymmv depending on where you live. You can definitely take a tad slower card and be fine - look up the card on https://www.videocardbenchmark.net/ and look for a card in that range that is priced good at your location, but dont go below 8 gb vram or you wont be happy.
And the next time you think your pc is too slow identify the slowest part and replace it (and sell off the old part), meaning that every few years you invest a little bit instead of a completely new mini-pc. same with broken parts - simply replace the part instead of the whole pc. it’s better regarding e-trash too.
Regarding the Steam Deck: it’s a nice device and i love mine to death, but for a main gaming rig it’s neither powerful enough nor upgradeable enough - you would be back at playing about the same stuff performancewise you do now.
The steam deck can only play pretty recent titles because it only runs on 1280*720, and uses upscaling, which doesn’t matter on the small screen, but it matters a lot on a larger display - i haven’t tried using my steam deck to play cyberpunk hooked up to the TV, and i won’t try it, because it’s clearly too underpowered for that and would simply suck.
If your tight on money, building a system will always come out on top in the long term, specifically in terms of upgrade paths to keep up with the times.
If you’re actually strapped for cash, buying a used system will always come on top. If you’re patient, watch goodwill and other spots for home-built systems that have new enough components to have an upgrade path in the future.
That’s a great midrange/budget rig!
Looking at OP’s link it’s still twice the cost though, and given their gaming requirements it may be overkill.
I would agree if space, portability, and modularity aren’t factors then your build is a very good suggestion.
Edit: I’m looking at a different Amazon than you probably, i didn’t think of that when i commented.
I think the big negative is that you can’t keep anything, even when just one aspect if the micro PC really needs an upgrade.
If I were you I’d try to build a cheap computer around the AM5 socket, using the PSU and Case you already have. Then you have a way forward open.
I agree with most of the comments in this thread, and I’ll add: there is zero need to purchase Windows 11.
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Can I persuade you towards a Steamdeck?
Main thing with those is a lack of extensibility and support from Chinese manufacturers.
At worse you buy one of those, find its limits and then upgrade to something else and use it for homelabing. I have some of them for that purpose.
Seconding steam deck, but also need to add in the docking station. That formfactor has stolen my heart, it does mobile gaming, along with having the horse power to be a PC substitute at home.
In addition to SteamOS, but ill let others promote linux and sticking it to microsoft now that linux desktops are finally crossing the “it just works” finish line.
You can do better. I’d get a miniITX form factor of your choice that supports a video card, but omit the card for now.
An amd with igpu might be decent for your needs today and slap a dgpu in later if your needs change.
It seems to me that mini ITX is small enough to cost a little bit more. The cheapest seem to be micro ATX boards.
Sorry for the unfamiliar platform, but here’s a comparison I recently made for a friend looking to build a computer around the AM5 socket.
1 CHF = 1.25 USD, but of course prices are different across the continents, so a direct comparison would be difficult. I just hope the fundamental price difference between sizes holds globally.
mITX is more expensive but is smaller and has some other advantages.
Are there any advantages that are worth it for that budget range?
The only one I know of so far was short DDR traces and a reduction to two slots for extreme memory overclocking.
I have almost this exact mini PC. It was ok for things like StarCraft 2 and the Sims 4. I tried playing a newer game like Stormgate and it couldn’t keep up.
I’ve since spent a bunch of money getting an eGPU set up, and have yet to have more than 5 gaming sessions in a row without a crash.
I probably could have saved a lot of money if I’d just gotten a PC with some headroom for upgrading, but I really didn’t think I’d want to.
At that point just buy a Steam Deck.
What’s the benefit of that Vs this? I don’t care for portability and I like the option to at least crack this open and expand a few bits (if I need to).
Steam deck is very repair friendly. I swapped my SOs SSD for a 2tb and it was very easy to work with. For the price, it’s extremely hard to beat. You can get a 30 dollar dock, and you’re off to the races.
A lot of those mini PCs don’t really have enough graphics power, even for older games. I have one and unless it’s something really low powered like Stardew or something, the experience is not great.
The Deck is designed for gaming, and it can double as a desktop PC.
These types of machines certainly have their place, and if it meets your needs, go for it.
The big downside is going to be a lack of upgradability. Most of the core components will be soldered to the motherboard, so no CPU or GPU upgrades, and no replacements if something breaks. I know the one you linked was just an example, and not necessarily “the one,” but its on-board graphics are similar in power to a GTX 1650. Lots and lots of games available at that level, but you’ll be locked out of anything newer with no clear upgrade path later.
For reference, I own something similar, but even older, as a secondary machine. It’s fine for what it does. Just be aware of the limitations. There are ways to build a similar-powered full desktop for about the same price. At that point it’s a tradeoff: would you rather be able to upgrade later, or do you want the simplicity and small form factor (portability, aesthetics, etc)?
+1 on the Steam Deck train. I’ve been in the hospital the last few days, it’s been a godsend, playing Silksong between doctor visits.
You can get a dock if you want a full sized monitor or a real mouse & keyboard. The deck also has two trackpads, which is sufficient for slower mouse games like city builders while in handheld mode.
Because Valve is selling a lot of Decks, game developers are starting to use it as a watermark for low-end performance when tuning their games.
I will admit the Deck’s CPU is a few years old, you can probably get a faster portable if you really want, but SteamOS makes things pretty easy. Technically I can drop the Deck into desktop mode with a Linux KDE environment, but I can’t remember the last time I had to. Maybe when I was trying Minecraft?
I suppose it’s not solely for gaming which turns me off the deck option; it would also be serving as the entry point for some self hosted stuff I’m running on the clunky old unit that’s still chugging along.
Ah, well, it does have a desktop mode, but it’s Linux + KDE, not Windows. It can probably do what you want, but it would be some adjustment to the new environment.
So possibly a false economy then?
I guess the scale of the unit is appealing - even a micro HPX doesn’t come close; but that’s the trade off I suppose.
Yeah. You’re basically buying a laptop crammed into a small box. May as well get a laptop if you need the small footprint and portability or a desktop if you need the price-to-performance.
Also, the Steam Deck thing people keep repeating is terrible advice. Even these can power their components somewhat robustly. A docked Steam Deck is still a 10W APU for no good reason. It depends on use case, in that you also get a handheld out of the deal, but if you’re looking for a primary device even a laptop would be a better choice.
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Are they cheaper, though?
GPU prices being what they are an equivalent full size card, and the same CPU aren’t far off the full build cost of the micro unit I linked to, and that’s before cases, power supplies and whatever.
I understand the service situation; but that’s not worse than my laptop/integrated devices - and this still has some scope for replacing non-soldered parts, presumably.
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How would you break it down?
PC Partpicker disagrees with you, especially at the reduced price on the Amazon micro option - making some assumptions on equivalence between the ‘baked in’ chips and proper GPU etc.
I’d assume that economies of scale play a part too.
But I’m willing to accept that I’m wrong!
What games do you play?
Do you care about fps and graphics settings?
Is it solely for gaming?
Three concerns:
- Heat - Will degrade faster and perform worse than it likely can because it will throttle itself
- Upgradability - Looks like only SSD and Memory are serviceable.
- Warranty - How is customer service? I have heard mixed reviews on most mini PC manufacturers.
This, this, and this.
As computer cases have gotten smaller the heat buildup has gotten bad. My mother in law had one of the SFF pc’s from 10 years ago and after about a year the HDD died. Replaced it with a used one I had that was 7200rpm vs 5400rpm and it was dead in 6 months. That drives twin still works today but was always in a tower case.
Heat kills CPU’s, RAM, MoBo’s, and everything else in the computer.
Upgrades are limited to RAM and SSD but those upgrades generally mean even more heat so then you end up thermal throttling. You could get an external GPU but now you have a huge brick sitting next to your little box pc. IMHO they agree great fir something like retro gaming/emulation but you will generally be better suited by a full size computer especially if you buy a board that has a long lived socket.
Warranties are great but the issue is that the warranty fairy will try to get out of it as often as possible. Generally this is done by pushing the blame onto someone else, usually the purchaser.
I personally buy a cheap case without a psu, then get a good power supply. A mid range MoBo like an AM5 B850 with a cheap compatible processor. Add some RAM and a SSD with a budget GPU then you end up with something to get started and closer to the end of the socket lifespan you can grab a better cpu and GPU then buy a cheap case and MoBo and have something you can sell, give to someone else, or use a a server. You will start with a better computer and end with a MUCH better system.
I started with an x470 with a Ryzen 1600 and 16GB of RAM and a used 1080ti. I doubled my ram (not as easily done on with ddr5 sadly) upgraded to a 5800x and am waiting for a GPU that isn’t outrageous in cost but will double my fps. My old cpu was dropped in a B450 with a used RX480 16GB of ram and a 1TB SSD for my stepson to use as a gaming machine similar to a steamdeck (ChimeraOS) and he upgraded the GPU to an RX7600.
I play with a Mini Itx and things do get a little hot so keep that in mind.
