On the side of the billionaires and the zionists. He’ll be the next president for sure.
And don’t forget he is also throwing trans people under the bus to.
just having lived in california is enough for a lot of states to vote against you
Good, it’s stupid to focus on an arbitrary number like that. We need real policy, not buzzwords. There should be a progressive income tax without loopholes or avoidance.
I wouldn’t vote for Gavin if he was the Democratic candidate. He is just as horrible as the other Democrats.
We need true change and true leaders that will change the government to work for the working class instead of the wealthy.
Trump 3.0 here we come
AOC is over 35…
Yeah. They’ve already turned on her here. Lemmy keeps pushing further and further left that anyone right of Stalin is a fascist MAGA conservative.
And voted to continue funding Israel. And Sanders voted for “Biden’s crime bill”.
So who would you vote for? JD Vance? Or you throwing your vote away and letting JD Vance win anyway?
No one said anything about Vance.
Who do think is running in place of Trump? The name is irrelevant. It is the Republican nominee. They are all complicit in genocide it doesn’t matter who it is. It will be the democrats and the republicans. Any other party is a vote for maga.
Are you that naive to think otherwise?
If a candidate wins, the blame doesn’t go on those who didn’t vote for them.
There’s way more blame on you for supporting a bad candidate despite people on your side telling you clearly and well ahead of time that they are not voting for them. You voted for a nonviable candidate, you’re the one who wasted your vote.
We don’t owe the Democrats any votes just because they aren’t Trump. They must earn it. We don’t accept that we should vote for “the lesser evil” so you can keep your privileged life comfortable, while throwing us vulnerable minorities under the bus.
You are confusing the democratic primary with the presidential election. I don’t support Gavin Newsome. However if my choice is a Republican or him I choose him. Not sure where you live but if you’re American you’re severely misinformed about how our system works. My guess is you voted third party then last year and essentially approved the genocide by Israel since trump blatantly said he supports then.
You’re the confused one, unfortunately. You’re just regurgitating Democratic party nonsense.
By voting for a lesser evil, you are still in fact voting for evil, and you’re okay with it because at least the lesser evil doesn’t touch you and yours. You don’t give a shit about minorites and the poor the Democrats use as rhetoric and abuse, you don’t care about the illegal war crimes funded by your tax dollars, you don’t care about genocides of brown people, they don’t affect you and that’s good enough for you.
If you had principals and you stuck to them, you’d vote for a candidate that upholds those principals, not just talks about them around elections. By voting for whatever the Democrats force down your throat, you reward the neo-liberal machine and keep it in power. You’re not saving the country, you’re not saving your children’s future, you’re just giving yourself a little bit more comfortable life, and damned by the consequences.
You blame us for refusing to vote for a candidate that promised to kill more and more of our people, and you’re confused why we don’t see it your way. We don’t get the benefit of your lesser evil, because it’s evil to us.
Vote for your lesser evil, they’ll lose again because we’re again telling you loudly we’ll not settle at the cost of our children being shredded to pieces by you party’s bombs, and again you’re to blame for the eventual result: fascist takeover.
And this is all assuming it hasn’t happened yet and there will be free elections anymore, and I’m not convinced you’ll have a true choice next time anyway.
Naive is when Americans are corralled to think into the way that you are thinking now. Why is it no one mentioned about primary-ing progressive alternative to Newsom? Everyone quickly assumed it’s Vance and Newsom immediately in the next presidential election.
Because therr is no one else running. Where is your candidacy announcement?
Why do you think Vance and Newsom are running? Where is your candidacy announcement? Americans are so pacified by their media.
I wasnt the one complaining about everyone else and not taking resposibility for my own actions here was i.
This has to stop. You CANNOT ignore the Republican opponent. It’s fucking ridiculous. Why do you not apply ANY scrutiny to the Republican candidate? You know they take over when the Democrat loses, right?
So even before the primary we can only choose Vance or Newsom huh. Can you make this into a trolley problem I can visualize?
Sure so the person I responded to is saying if they were on a trolley, 1 track is Israeli genocide, the other track is Immigrants in America. Before reaching the split there is a station that you can get off and vote in the primaries and support a candidate that supports nothing. There is an option to bypass the station and run over a nuke that kills everyone which can be triggered by voting for anyone other than a democrat candidate.
The person I commented to said they would rather kill immigrants and palistinian people than vote for Newsome in the presidential election. Hope this helps.
I wouldn’t vote for Gavin if he was the Democratic candidate. He is just as horrible as the other Democrats.
For fuck’s sake, you people are so ridiculous. It’s like you don’t even care what Trump is doing to the country. Fuck any “progressive” who helped bring him back to power.
For every step forward, this prick takes 3 steps back.
The only reason Newsom has had any interest from the broader electorate is that he was outspoken in opposing Trump. The minute he enters the primary and starts spouting the same valueless, donor-approved, corporate drivel as Kamala, Jefferies, Schumer, etc., he’s going to flame out fast.
You mean idiots will refuse to vote for him while refusing to scrutinize his opposition.
His, “opposition,” is going to be other Democratic primary challengers. Can you at least wait until there’s a nominee before you start in with the, “Oh, you want the Republicans to win!?!?” bullshit?
If Newsome gets the nod, which is the assumption we were all OBVIOUSLY operating one for the purpose of this conversation, people are already all over this thread saying they wouldn’t vote him and would hand the presidency to Republicans.
Just like they did last November. They’re right to scrutinize Harries, every politician should be. But they’re WRONG to stop at Harris. They give Trump a pass. Then they act like they have the moral high ground and gloat about bringing Trump back to power.
If Newsome gets the nod, which is the assumption we were all OBVIOUSLY operating one for the purpose of this conversation
That’s a weird assumption to make considering I started this conversation by saying, “The minute [Newsom] enters the primary…he’s going to flame out fast.”
They love to simp for the DNC, check their history. They are currently defending Newsom doing this and other things he’s done.
It’s just fascinating to watch someone argue that we can’t criticize the Democratic nominee without helping Republicans even though we’re three years away from getting a Democratic nominee.
No criticism, only votes!
No platform, only votes!
No primaries, only votes!
No speech, only votes!
You voted in a way they didn’t like? HOW DARE YOU!
I feel like people have completely forgotten that Kamala was at like 3% when she bowed out of the primaries.
The hatred of trump might propel a dem who otherwise has no chance. like when Biden won. Against any competent republican he would have been clobbered.
She was the vice president, the person we choose to take over when a president is incapacitated. I would love to hear about all the ways she’s worse than Trump.
Nothing more infuriating to see people thoroughly scrutinize one candidate while absolutely refusing to do so for the other.
They didn’t say anything about Trump, they said she had no shot of winning the primary, which is true. She was on track to lose every single state, including California, where she was a sitting senator. If you think describing polling data from a 5 year old primary is somehow saying Kamala is, “worse than Trump,” you should log off for a while, maybe take a walk or something.
they said she had no shot of winning the primary
The neither did Sanders.
She was NOT GOING TO LOSE CALIFORNIA. For fuck’s sake, who could possibly be this fucking stupid. You know the election happened right? SHE WON CALIFORNIA, YOU IMPOSSIBLE DUMBASS.
She was essentially a younger Biden so you might want to look into whatever unconscious issues you have with voting for a non-white man.
You’re saying Harris shouldn’t have been elected… that means you support Trump. You certainly worked extra hard for him spreading your bullshit lies and blatant propaganda. You’re the same as MAGA, no thought, no reasoning, no HONESTY. Fucking shameful.
She was NOT GOING TO LOSE CALIFORNIA. For fuck’s sake, who could possibly be this fucking stupid.
OK, but yes, she absolutely was..
You know the election happened right? SHE WON CALIFORNIA, YOU IMPOSSIBLE DUMBASS.
Again, no. She dropped out before the California ballot deadline, most likely to spare herself the embarrassment of losing her home state.
The neither did Sanders.
Sanders won several states. Kamala was polling so badly she dropped out before Iowa.
I’m sorry that accurately remembering the 2020 primary is so upsetting to you, but Kamala did not win a single state, even as a VP choice. She dropped out in December of 2019. Voting started in February of 2020. Biden eventually secured the nomination, and on August 11th, the day that the final state voted, he named Kamala as his running mate.. Anyway, maybe before you jump into a thread and start calling people dumbasses, you should make sure that literally everything you’re saying isn’t wrong.
Notice how @MiddleAgesModem@lemmy.world didn’t have any reply to you giving citations, almost like they can’t face facts. Weird!
I’m sure they’re just planning to quietly delete their comments once they’re sure everyone’s stopped paying attention.
If this is the Democratic candidate, and there is no adequate progressive 3rd party candidate, 2028 will be the first election I sit out since 2000.
I am DONE accepting milquetoast corporate right wing democrats just because they aren’t literally insane. John Kerry was my first, and Kamala Harris is my last. I swear to fucking god.
It fucking blows my mind that with all Trump is doing, you people STILL refuse to learn what happens when good is positioned to be the enemy of perfect.
Heads up bud-
There will NEVER be a candidate you will like. Because ALL of them know how the game is played. YOU don’t. And as a result of this, from your perspective, they will all fail you in one way or another… guaranteed.
So go ahead and pout and stay at home all because a perfect candidate isn’t running. The rest of us will be voting against fascism while you’re enjoy those cartoons on Election Day.
Yeah, I feel you. I also feel the person responding to. In this case, if we’re going to reflect on the past, I’d like to see a considerable share of the blame placed on the millions (what 84 million?) that actually voted FOR Prince Don. If we’re looking to the future, I’d suggest that any person seeking voter support be meaningful and have good faith effort solutions.
Awful hard to convince people to care if their ending is the same either way.The ending is NOT the same either way. And suggesting it would be is in very bad faith.
The shit we’re dealing with would not have happened under Kamala’s presidency.
I guess you missed the part where I said I’ve done exactly what you are suggesting for nearly 30 years now. I mean, what’s the definition of insanity, again?
I’m not looking for a perfect, ideal candidate. I’m looking for a candidate that doesn’t continue to help the right shift the Overton window further in their direction. Especially in the case of corporate power and campaign finance. That’s it. Bill Clinton was why my first vote was cast was for Ralph Nader. George Bush, and everyone blaming him on people like me, was why I “fell in line” with the Democrats. I’m done playing their games until they’re done playing the Game you are referring to. Democrats have become complacent, feckless, and lazy. They need to learn how to earn a vote like mine again. Zohran understood this. Sorry, I’m voting for whomever I feel like from now on.
Oh I didn’t miss anything. And my oh my that’s certainly a lovely paragraph of hot-button topics you got there! Straight out of the Far-Leftists Playbook that outraged so many into not voting against fascism.
The Left is not the reason Kamala lost, the facts DO NOT SUPPORT this narrative. You are spreading misinformation because it is part of a story that riles you up and “feels” right to you, it is irresponsible.
Back up your accusations or stop pushing this narrative.
Agree to disagree.
Where is your proof then?
My proof? Ninety one million people didn’t vote in 2024, Lemmy was full of kids yelling at people to not vote. There was also roughly 3-4 million people rust toyed for 3rd party spoilers.
It’s safe to say that had the spoiled brats not convinced people to would have voted for Kamila to not vote, and had voted against Trump like they said they hated so much, she’d have had potential to win.
Not to mention that a wave of people influencing others to vote against fascism would have been a huge help instead of “wAaAaAaAaA! bOtH SiDeS!”
Now I’m sure you have your little article that trump would have won regardless all queued up- but take note that I’m not talking about the bullshit they used to excuse away the assholes that chose not to stand in the way of a fascist.
I’m talking about the momentum that would have made the difference in those that would have voted for the left but DIDN’T. Not the dickeads that would have voted for Trump.
If you didn’t vote for Kamala, you chose fascism. And I’m not going to debate this any longer.
Reposting for mod:
As usual, no proof from them.
[zero proof was even given by the troll, as expected]
I feel that.
FINALLY. Someone thinking about the billionaires.
Can we stop being stupid?
This doesn’t mean he thinks billionaires shouldn’t pay more taxes. It means it’s childish and stupid to focus on a single number when it comes to actual policy.
I’d argue. It’s pretty fucking stupid if you can’t wrap your head around how the destruction of the middle class in America and the consolidation of wealth in the hands of 10,000 or so people has been a fucking tragedy for our political system. Hell it’s been a tragedy for our countries basic cohesion. I don’t really think you need to be labeling things as stupid. You didn’t even come up with a real rebuttal. This reply was moronic and there’s really nothing else I can go on so: fuck you have a great day.
Here’s a policy suggestion. Remove citizens united.
Uh ok? I agree with that and nothing I said would indicate otherwise.
You know what stupid not seeing this for what it is. Pandering to billionaires for campaign contributions. Thus the citizens unit comment. I just wanted to get in there and really spell it out for you because you seem a bit dim.
You know what stupid not seeing this for what it is. Pandering to billionaires for campaign contributions.
Jesus christ, you guys are such excitable morons. Newsome will undo Trump’s tax cuts. Everyone knows that, including billionaires.
Keep calling me stupid when you believe in some dumbfuck baseless conspiracy theory that Newsome raising taxes SOMEHOW won’t affect billionaires so they’ll give him money.
More bullshit unsubstantiated lies from MAGA’s best friend, phoney fucking “prorgressives” who can’t think past fucking buzzwords.
Most of the political issues I’m dealing with stem from wealth inequality. That makes me a single issue voter. Perhaps that is childish.
And when has putting in Republicans in power improved wealth inequality? You’re a single issue voter helping the party that opposes said issue. Pretty fucking embarrassing.
I really hope that Democrats are starting to realize that corporate captured performance artists like Gavin Newsom are why we have been lurching rightward into fascism for 40+ years. They are why there’s been no meaningful opposition. Newsome doesn’t believe in anything beyond a vague allegiance to capital interests and his own career advancement. Sometimes that ethos will cause him to say some good things, and sometimes he’ll do the opposite. But, he’ll never, ever meaningfully change anything at all.
The best case scenario with a Newsom presidency is that he will preside over a temporary slowing of the collapse, while sowing the seeds of further escalation by the white-identity, religious authoritarian dominionists that are flourishing under trump. Democrats, Americans, and the world deserve much more than him.
I really hope that Democrats are starting to realize that corporate captured performance artists like Gavin Newsom are why we have been lurching rightward into fascism for 40+ years.
So there are two possible interpretations for why the Democrats are so stubbornly useless:
-
It’s a big club and you ain’t in it.
-
You can’t get a man to understand something when his salary depends on not understanding it.
Either way there’s no “realizing” anything.
-
No surprise to anyone who’s been paying attention to what he does instead of what he says.
At some point the left needs to realize that sitting out voting doesn’t work. Yes the candidate sucks from your political stance but they are better than the alternative and it gives a platform from which to push left. This has been the playbook of the right for decades and is why they have been so successful in shifting the Overton window. They vote in any circumstance even if the candidate isn’t as right leaning as they would prefer but to them at least it’s not a dem.
Edit: to be clear I’m all for taxing billionaires and corporations far more.
Your vote is your voice. A vote is earned not expected.
Every vote is a push in one direction or the other in the US. You can vote to push right, you can vote to push left, or you can avoid voting and let the rest of us decide for you. But the last time a bunch of leftists weren’t thrilled with the options, the electorate voted to push right. From your valid gripes against Newsom, I’m gonna guess that was not what you wanted.
Come election day, one of the two candidates is guaranteed to become president. You cannot stop that. I won’t try to say Newsom is ideal or even a good candidate. I’d love to see someone else run instead. But if you want an even more leftist candidate next time, the country has to show they’ll tolerate movement in that direction, and that means not electing another fucking Republican.
As a permanent resident who cannot vote but pays 6 figures in taxes. VOTE. Some of us aren’t so lucky
I’ll never vote for Newsom. I’ve stated that on here before. He’s anti-trans and deep in corporate pockets. The Getty family owns him.
So you’re ok with Trump. Got it. How’s his stance on Trans people?
Staunch third party voter reporting in. Voting for the big two feels like an obligation given to me by the powerful. Third party is vastly more exciting!
Burn down that’s why needs to be done. So fuck yall hell Newsome already acting like Trump. By 2028 he be the Trump of 2016. The Democrats always move further right. Look at his fucking tweets. You think he just making fun of Trump but worse he thinks acting childish like him will win him those Republican votes.
Just like Harris running around with the Cheney they rather court Republicans then give progressive an inch. So voting for them or Republican not going do shit. Hell you just going get a blue fascist instead of red.
Here we go again… “If you don’t vote for Biden you support Trump!” … “If you don’t vote for Harris you support Trump!” … “If you don’t vote for X you support Trump!”
I wonder how that works in solid color states. If you vote third party in a solid blue state, does that mean a vote for red? Or is it actually a vote for blue if you ask for a red voter’s opinion on the matter?
Going off the theory that your vote is actually for the person a particular voter opposes, does that mean your protest vote is actually determined by the popular vote? For example, if you protest voted the 2024 election, does that mean you actually voted blue because red won the popular vote? Assuming that every color says the protest vote voted for their enemies.
Every action is a vote for something. It never hurts to consider the consequences.
By all means push forward a better candidate than Newsom. And I hope you succeed. But if you don’t, and it turns out that in the end it’s going to be either Newsom or Vance (or even Trump), then who would you rather have?
Why can’t voters just vote for candidates that actually care about the working class?
Why do we have to play this “fall in line” nonsense so rich people can be even richer?
Why are we so stupid and proud of it?
“This candidate is not perfect enough for me, a paragon of virtue, and he’s worse than having a right wing dictatorship under trump” is what I am hearing from a lot of people and boy do it smell like bitch in here.
It’s not the left who sits out, it’s less politically engaged people. Bought out “Centrist” candidates fail to motivate turnout while getting negligible Republican voters to switch. Progressive candidates do better at both. They’re safer bets. Left wingers try and explain this and get blamed
We still have ample time to get someone better than Gavin.
And so it begins. Abandon all progressive ideas to appeal to the “centrist”, only to lose to the fascist again. I hate it here.
Gavin never supported progressive ideals?
Eh, early in his term he did a bunch of good stuff, it’s just rightly overshadowed by the bad stuff.
Yeah and while he’s probably not enough of a progressive, he also might not be bothering with the billionaire tax because the billionaires would all just fly off Hawaii or Nevada or Jackson Hole or wherever to avoid paying it anyway.
It needs to be nationwide, but Newsom probably wouldn’t do that as president either. Too many billionaire pals and donors.
he also might not be bothering with the billionaire tax because the billionaires would all just fly off Hawaii or Nevada or Jackson Hole or wherever to avoid paying it anyway.
That basically never actually happens. See: New York.
You can’t abandon ideals that you never held.
deleted by creator
Eric “we love capitalism” Schmidt?
This and he was married to that thing Don Jr. was with.
Yuck.
Eww explains a lot
At this point in time I’m pretty sure you would win in a landslide if you ran on taxing billionaires. Is being greedy a requirement to be a politician in the US?
If you’re not greedy, the billionaires won’t fund your campaign. Then you lose.
Well, added context is billionaires won’t fund your campaign causing your public relations to drop. Then you lose.
We shouldn’t just scapegoat the rich for something that tens of millions of people vote for while tens of millions more don’t vote at all.
Irrelevant context. As a great sage once said
If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice
This is a binary system one OR the other will win. There is no other outcome. You either push to influence it in a better or worse direction you dont get to sit it out. The result WILL effect you.
It is relevant and important context because we solve this problem by convincing the millions of people, not the rich.
A wise famous playwrite once said:
"Putting the cart before the horse ".
“Putting the cart before the horse”
Which is what youre doing by waiting for your perfect fantasy candidate rather than working with the good enough reality.
You must have me confused with somebody else.
If Newsom wins the primary then I’ll be singing his praises, you can sleep well knowing that much.
I dont believe you. Especially after your previous posts. And god know how many others youve influenced with those “stay home and wait for perfect” ideals.
That would only be true if most people couldn’t think for themselves and it was possible to spend money to influence their opinion.
Exactly.
Huh. What got deleted by a mod if you agree?
Don’t know. What got deleted?
Whatever you were replying to.
The thing I replied to says, “That would only be true if most people couldn’t think for themselves and it was possible to spend money to influence their opinion”.
