- cross-posted to:
- politics@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- politics@lemmy.world
Summary
According to the Telegraph, a leaked confidential Trump peace plan delivered to President Zelenskyy has caused panic in Kyiv.
The proposal would grant the U.S. half of revenues from Ukraine’s resource extraction and licensing, effectively amounting to economic colonization.
The Telegraph noted, “Trump’s demands would amount to a higher share of Ukrainian GDP than reparations imposed on Germany at the Versailles Treaty, later whittled down at the London Conference in 1921, and by the Dawes Plan in 1924.”
Simultaneously, the plan would absolve Russia for its invasion that has caused hundreds of thousands of deaths.
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Who had Trump and Putie collude to Own Ukraine on their Fascist Dictator Bingo cards?
That’s the free space
I had “Ukraine is fucked” as the first thing on my list of outcomes if Trump won the election. Does that count? 😔
Well, Europe needs to grow a pair and tell Trump to fuck off. We need to accept that he is leaving Nato, and European countries need to take it over or set up a new organisation. He can make any deal he likes with Russia; Europe and Ukraine can just tell him no and show him the true limits of his power. He cannot dictate to Europe and he is not our president.
But all leaders have to be on the same page.
And then this needs to be agreed upon once again so that the current president of the european council makes a clear statement.
If they got the balls the transition period will take some time I suppose.
This is what is leveraged currently, imo.
But this isn’t mostlikely the entire world dynamic… Idk.
I really hope Europe starts making some moves.
From the moment he won the election until now we’ve seen a lot of world leaders attempting to make nice with him and appease him. It should be clear now that he cannot be appeased nor will his ego ever be satisfied. He is going to take and take and take until other countries start telling him no and laying out boundaries that they’re willing to strictly enforce if need be.
Did you leave it intentionally vague wether you were talking about P or T? I kind of find it nice how it fits both, how similar they are.
Nah that wasn’t my intention. It’s true that they’re similar, but I’ve mostly been watching American politics.
In the US, there seems to be little understanding of the situation in Europe, which can create false hope. Europe is dealing with the same shit as the US, it’s just way behind. But it’s going the same direction.
Also, Europe is not enough of a united entity. There are still national states, it’s easy to stir up nationalistic moods. And in many European countries, pro-billionaire populists and far-right parties are getting to power.
I wouldn’t say there’s no hope at all, but let’s look at the real situation.
Leaving Nato drastically increases the chances he attacks Canada and attacking Canada will cause a civil war. 100%
If Trump takes Canada, he better occupy it and not integrate it politically.
Adding 40 million people to the US population without representation seems unlikely. With representation, that many people with Canadian opinions will mean no more Republican House or President for generations. Are the 10 provinces getting senate seats? 2 each? Never another red senate if that happens. Electoral College votes?
Honestly, he is going to add the second largest country in the world as a single state? Good luck.
Will 51st state Canadians be able to move to other parts of the US? Because just the snowbirds already there would turn Florida, Texas, Arizona, and Nevada blue overnight.
the 51st state thing is tabloid level headline nonsense
there is no way it would happen peacefully. , it would only happen after a military invasion or a coup backed by the US. Abandon any idea of Canada becoming a state, it would be occupied territory without legal representation and likely very few if any rights. and it would remain that way for at least a generation or two before any small “new states” were carved out, and collaborators would be allowed to rule over small regions for the interest of keeping the peace. after a healthy amount of colonization of American loyalists, murder of Canadians and imprisonment of dissidents. but all in all. make no mistake, it would be a shooting war, and it would certainly cause civil war in america too, as this is a red line.
you need only look to Eastern Ukraine to see how this sort of thing plays out.
Armed coercion, military invasion, fake referendums, importing migrants to replace the dead and evicted with "colonists’. suppression , imprisonment and murder of locals who dont swear fealty. etc.
As an American, it scares the hell out of me, but I agree with you.
They need to embargo us.
Make the US economy absolute dog shit so the GOP gets nuked in 2026. There’s enough GOP Senate seats in play to remove Trump from office in early 2027.
I actually agree with you. I think there needs to be a global summit right now. Every country but the US is invited.
We need to figure out how everybody can stop buying or selling to the US immediately. We need to reflow trade to make that happen.
Yes, it will be painful. But, in my view, it needs to happen.
And this is the problem with “America first.” Those who are the most selfish inevitably find themselves alone and miserable.
Europe is not united enough. Lot’s of states deal with their own rise of fascism. It’s depressing.
In Canada, the public discourse has finally caught up with this. We’ll see how long Europe takes to get past the denial stage.
It’s beginning, i hope it grow strong enough because it will take a few years of pain before we emerge stronger. I doubt the majority of Canadian have a strong enough resolve now. We can easily be divided.
After JD Vance’s little trip to Europe, a lot of European countries are beginning to consider the US to be an adversary.
I like to think that the majority of Americans also think of the Musk/Trump regime as an adversary.
It very plainly is an adversary to any country that values freedom. Land of the oppressed and home of the cowardly.
So a mafia protection racket?
Except for protection.
Should bring up the whole administration on RICO charges.
The telegraph is a right-wing outfit and should be viewed through the lens of that bias. This article repeats their undermining of Ukraine.
Also it doesn’t mention much of a “peace plan”, these are just Trump’s terms to “reparate” him for all the aid the US sent to Ukraine. Ukraine didn’t sign this exact deal because it didn’t even offer them any security guarantees in return. Clickbait journalism.
I knew as much as soon as I read “panic in Kyiv”.
They love to make Europe look scared.
Putin’s puppet doing his job well. The Orange Turd delivers garbage as usual.
Putin’s puppet
“Putin’s puppet” is the ceo of the wealthiest country in the world and the strongest army in history. You probably don’t like to hear but if there are any puppets they are most likely the 10 times weaker players
Or are easily manipulated narcissists. Trump before running for office in the first place laundered money for Russian oligarchs and an extensive and prolonged Russian based disinformation is the main reason he has the cult he does. Also key point: everything Trump has done indicates he is a coward. It doesn’t matter how strong a coward is
Trump is scum, one of the biggest on earth same as his russian counterpart. Claiming the ceo of USA is a puppet of a country 10 times weaker is ignoring the scale and capabilities of US government military.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_highest_military_expenditures
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_American_military_installations
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010s_global_surveillance_disclosures
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_assassinations_by_the_United_States
Yes, I am ignoring the US military; because it is irrelevant. It’s like arguing that a man’s car can’t be stolen because he’s a heavyweight boxing champion. How many bases do you need to build before the US is immune to sabotage and subversion? How much money do you need to spend on guns before disinformation campaigns don’t work? It is not as simple as one country being weaker than another. Different countries have different capabilities depending on what they have focused on. Russia has been building it’s disinformation pipeline for a long time and has always been very good at exploiting corruption. The US is not very good at defending itself from those kinds of attacks as experts have been warning for frickin decades. This is not a video game where election interference is only targetable on nations in your level range and national strength can neatly be condensed into a single number and compared.
Or have I misunderstood your argument and your arguing that Putin has nothing to force Trump to obey him? Yet still in that argument the US military and the assassinations are still irrelevant. Trump is Putin’s puppet not because Putin is a master manipulator dangling some blackmail over Trump’s head. Putin’s an unhinged, cowardly nutjob who spends most of his time hiding in a bunker marinating in the propaganda he himself commissioned. No, it’s because Trump is a moron who accepts simple answers and lashes out at anyone who tells him he’s wrong. Trump is a stupid man smart enough to know he’s an idiot but terrified people will realise he’s an idiot. He is a weak man desperate to be recognised as a strong one. So when someone who he views as a strong man dangles the potential for their approval in front of him he wags his tail like a good little dog. The former Australian PM talked about how Trump looked at Putin with awe to the degree that it was creepy. That is why Putin worked so hard to get him elected, why Trump spends so long on phone calls with Putin and why the military might of the US has no bearing on whether or not Trump will do as Putin tells him to. Trump is also very, very willing to accept bribes in whatever form they take and shown no limits to what he is willing to sell out for those bribes.
Don’t bother. People here would rather have Putin as god-emperor than face the reality of institutional failure that got them here. Twice.
How is Israel paying back? Or those are donations? 🤔
Good job inbred Americans.
Take foreign policy issues up with the leaders who proposed them. Leave innocent citizens out of this, and support those who resist Trump.
Ethnic and cultural insults only furthers the divide between European and American culture.
Mmmm gonna have to disagree, as an American. None of this happened in a vacuum, of course, but our citizenry inarguably shit the bed quite thoroughly here, and now we need to lay in it. Fascism and oligarchy are the order of the day here, as are protectionism, isolationism, xenophobia, racism, and nativism. By all means support the resistance, but American culture is, at this point, rife with things to not be proud of. I’ve never felt more politically or ideologically alienated in my life. Our playbook is not it. Use us as a cautionary tale. I hope we can pull out of this tailspin at some point, but I’m not sure that’s a guaranteed thing - and for god’s sake don’t follow our lead here.
Ok, but domestic shame has nothing to do with geopolitics. Other actors can act on that shame to influence american politics, I guess.
However, if European leaders start taking up the viewpoint that all Americans are racists and imperialists, then relations will only further deteriorate. Americans could be subject to sanctions and banned from Europe. American refugees will be turned away. Americans will be subject to hate crimes. Trump-aligned fascists will play up Americans’ fears and use the international hatred of Americans to drum up support.
A state’s foreign policy is not, and has never been, equivalent to the culture of it’s people.
I say this as an American immigrant in Europe.
Then wear your share of the shame
I’m not sure you read what that person wrote correctly.
our citizenry inarguably shit the bed quite thoroughly here, and now we need to lay in it.
That is them taking their share of the blame. Perhaps reading comprehension isn’t your strong suit?
I thought that was what I was expressing?
It’s the same rationale for why Russian civilians don’t get a free pass, except we voted our way here, which is worse.
Well… If I was China, I’d see this as a motivation to invade Taiwan.
If the invasion works, it works.
If it doesn’t, simply wait for a US president that isn’t able to plan 3 days ahead.
I wonder if Taiwan is mulling over a peaceful reunification with China as a result of this mess. Their independence depends in large part on US support, but with Trump at the helm they’re likely to face extortion when they need it most.
Trump has already directed the removal of language saying Taiwan is NOT independent (pissing off the Chinese) and is trying to scale back the CHIPS Act (making us more dependent on Taiwan). Putting those two things together with this “deal” for Ukraine, it feels to me like he is setting us up for a Chinese invasion of Taiwan where he can make a similar “deal” with Taiwan where we protect them in exchange for 50% of their chip making profits.
Trump signs deals and then just ignores them when he sees fit. He lies about everything. Look at what he is trying to do to Canada who he has a free trade deal with that he signed and said was the best deal ever. Guy is a liar.
If this will happen expect Americans to die in terrorist attacks.
Strange way for the US to concede their defeat. (One more!) But to each their own.
Why would anybody expect a genocidal empire to stop another genocidal empire? They’re the same thing.
Ukraine should have allied with palestinians, the global south, and other people resisting invasion and colonization by empire(s).
Why would anybody expect a genocidal empire to stop another genocidal empire? They’re the same thing.
Nations don’t cooperate/conflict over how many similarities they have (although that makes things easier), but over how much their interests are aligned. It is well possible for two genocidal empires to oppose as adversaries, e.g. Nazi Germany and Soviet Union, the latter being proud of stopping the former.
Another example, colonizing empires fighting over their colonies. Neither did so to free the colony of the oppressor, but to become/remain that oppressor. You can imagine these empires as much the same as you like, they can still have conflicting interests (as in who rules the colony, not wether anyone should) resulting in fights up to World Wars.
Ukraine should have allied with palestinians, the global south, and other people resisting invasion and colonization by empire(s).
How would that have helped them, apart from moral feelings? How many tanks, artillery systems, intel or even humanitarian aid would that have provided? Aren’t the proposed countries more receivers of such things than donors?
Credit to Putin, it’s a good play. The only counter is for Europe to unite against both Russia and the current US government.
Theoretically possible, but unlikely unless the non-EU states also fall in line early.
Do it. Fuck US.
No, don’t Fuck the US. I dont want to pay for Trump and kins sins.
Just fuck Trump, Musk, and the republican party and its support/propaganda network.
I will gladly endorse having foreign forces enter america to arrest these traitors to humanity, to take them to the hague for trial and execution.
As an American, we are all going to suffer and the earlier the better. Time and time again we see that the only way Trump supporters change is if they are personally affected. Thus we all need to pay in order to see change.
Too many people think that everyone in the US deserves to suffer just because 23% of us voted for the Orange Shitstain, and that’s if you believe nobody “found” him some extra votes.
Too many Americans think the rest of the world can afford to think of Individual Americans right now.
The USA is attacking other countries. What individual US citizens think about that is irrelevant unless they can stop him. If they cannot, the rest of us need to treat the US as a single entity and defend against it accordingly.
It’s because 51% of you didn’t vote against him.
More than that, the numbers I keep seeing thrown around are that Harris got 75m votes, Trump got 77m, and 90m didn’t bother voting.
Do you know how many Germans voted for Hitler’s party in 1933? It was 26.4%.
The reality is that the EU states are falling out.
What we have to realize is that, if this were WWII, the one playing Germany is now the US.
The lesson from WWII was that you do not appease the aggressor. Europe has to oppose the US. It does not matter how difficult that seems. They have to.
If not, Trump is not stopping at Ukraine. He will make demands of all of Europe while tariffing and cutting his own European defence spending the entire time.
The time to stand-up to Trump is now.
Back Ukraine. Stand up to the US. Russia is contained as long as we find Ukraine. The USA is not.
Imagine telling Americans during the second red scare, about the political climate of today. History is weird.
The Telegraph noted, “Trump’s demands would amount to a higher share of Ukrainian GDP than reparations imposed on Germany at the Versailles Treaty, later whittled down at the London Conference in 1921, and by the Dawes Plan in 1924.”
This is an extraordinarily bad move.
I’m glad to see steps taken toward the war ending, but this is the sort of Big Mac diplomacy that’s just patently moronic. Trump seems to think he can just order up what he wants and it’s going to magically happen without any negative consequences.
Even if you’re a world superpower, there’s only so much you can demand of another country. The Iraq embargo, for instance, gave rise to Al Qaeda and the eventual destruction of the World Trade Towers. (And that was the SECOND attempt, after a group of terrorists tried to bomb them previously in the 90’s.)
I’m quite certain that this deal is intended to be unpalatable to Ukraine - it was cooked up by Trump and Putin after all.
Either way they win:
Ukraine takes the deal: they win; Ukraine says the deal is ridiculous and walks away: then Russia & Trump brand them as unrealistic agitants and delay for more favourable terms and extend the war.
this deal is intended to be unpalatable to Ukraine
Oh, I get that. Still pretty stupid.
Like I simply could not believe he thinks he could add that. Even the most tyrannical warlords of the past didn’t demand that much tribute from people they conquered. The Mongols and Romans would blush at this shit.
The Iraq embargo, for instance, gave rise to Al Qaeda and the eventual destruction of the World Trade Towers.
This is a racist narrative that relies on the assumption that Arabs have no control over themselves and “they’re all the same”. Also relies on the false narrative that Saddam Hussein supported Al Qaeda that was promoted during the build up to the Iraq War.
The reality is that Al Qaeda were enemies of Saddam Hussein, because not all Arabs are the same person. And a psychopath like Saddam Hussein doesn’t want other psychopaths around as competition.
Try to see past American exceptionalism and understand that not everything in the world is defined by it’s relation to the US.
Osama Bin Laden literally referenced the sanctions against Iraq in his fatwa justifying his attacks on Americans.
But okay. Thank you for your response and your insights.
Bin Laden would say anything to get recruits. Fact is, Al Qaeda had a lot of operations going on against Saddam Hussein.
But okay, believe everything a mass murderer says. That makes you a very enlightened person LOL
The Iraq embargo, for instance, gave rise to Al Qaeda and the eventual destruction of the World Trade Towers.This is a racist narrative that relies on the assumption that Arabs have no control over themselves and “they’re all the same”.
Nah. Even if we assume (which we do) that Arabs, like any other group of people, aren’t all the same, and that they do have (partial) control over themselves, like anyone else … the decisions and fates of a sufficiently large number of them can still be influenced by a sufficiently large external influence, such as revoked access to international trade. Sometimes in chaotic ways. Heck, if billboard ads work in influencing people, it seems difficult to believe more intrusive changes to people’s lifes would have no effect.
Since the article already mentions it, for example Germany between the WWs. The height of reparations was helpful for nationalistic and ultimately again militaristic groups in Germany to gain power. Not as an automatism, not as a justification, simply recognizing a statistical causality. Peace isn’t equal peace. What’s a foul peace worth? We need conditions which support a stable and peaceful coexistence, not plant the seeds for the next war.
I am so fucking embarrassed to be an American. Fuck this country and its “leaders”
Don’t be embarrassed for the actions of poloticians. We only have the illusion of choice in the US. You can be embarrassed for the human race if you like. Cause “leaders” like this exist in the first place.
Politicians gain their power from The People. It is alarming as an American that nearly half the country actually wants this to happen because “the other side is getting hurt” without recognizing that they too will suffer alongside the people they are told to dislike.
What was that infamous quote from POTUS LBJ again? “Convince the poorest white that he’s better than the richest black so you can pick his pockets clean [paraphrasing]”
More accurate:
The “leaders” of the human race have a long history of shaping "the people"s lives so that they suseptible to being convinced by poloticians. It’s like fighting against the addictive powers of social media. They hire the best to make it addictive. Many people just can’t mentally compete. That said, voter turnout was 64%, so only 32% ish voted for this. And a large part were probably dupped by the messaging.
Our people did this. I see the ignorance and stupidity on a daily basis. People are cheering this shit on. It’s disgraceful.
Hopefully, we’ll open Canada’s doors to Americans like you soon. Sending you digital hugs my friend.
I really appreciate you saying this (although I’m not OP). I’m scared for my family, my kid is in the LGBTQ community, and we live in fucking Florida, the smelly dick of the US. We are getting our passports setup just in case.
I work in maintenance/construction, and I’m surrounded by MAGA screaming idiots. These people can’t be argued with. All these people care about is hurting others. It’s astounding what this country has become. A shell of its former self. The US has already failed, and none of them can see it.
Trans refugees have been mentioned as the first priority, if that’s what’s going on.
I work in maintenance/construction
Dope, you’ll find work easily. Our housing supply is jacked. I know one guy that got pulled out of retirement to be a foreman three days a week, and he says they’re paying him like he’s full-time and then some. You might even have a shot at economic migration now, although that system is a nightmare.
Like the other person mentioned, for that reason, if there’s a ton of Americans coming up all at once it’s recommend bringing your own accommodations. Even if it’s not a winter-safe RV, people can and do build a little insulated enclosure to protect the plumbing and manage heating costs.
We’ve got a housing shortage, so if we open the door to American refugees we’re going to need a lot of construction workers.
Also in Florida. Love the state, hate the people.
With the number of Canadians leaving Florida, I don’t expect you will be needing much home construction soon.
And that concerns me for Canadians. If things continue on a downward trend, Americans with serious money (note: I do not have “serious” money) will head to Canada, further exacerbating the housing shortage.
Fellow Floridian keeping eyes on an out, but neither my wife nor I are quite “skilled” enough to go be able to get jobs elsewhere. She may be able to but she works in the arts so it likely wouldn’t pay much. I could work anywhere being in IT but I’m not specialized enough to get anything they wouldn’t just hire locally for.
Hang in there. Ive always said Florida is the best state if it wasn’t for the Floridians.
Unfortunately, they are not 100% the problem. Certain groups of loyal citizens put them there.
So while I agree, fuck every politician in office, let’s not forget to give credit where credit is due to the “american” people.
And don’t tell me those same people are just brainwashed. No, those same people would have put a fascist in power regardless of how educated they are. Evangelicals are just clueless and even the smart ones suck cheeto dick.
Sincerely, thank you for specifying the State religion of evangelical “Supply Side Jesus” as its own evil cult, and not alienating the rest of us who stand with you. I always appreciate that nuance in this kind of discourse.
There’s a lot of Christians here, myself included, horrified by every second of this, watching people calling themselves “christians” give themselves over willingly to corruption and sheer evil and unfiltered hatred at an alarming rate.
Of course we’re silenced on many fronts: Most of the money for churches comes from powerful americultist organizations and donors, who are obviously in the angry orange baby Hitler’s pocket, and they’re seeding such hateful polarization that even leftists are turning on us and discounting us outright.
We’re not as loud, well-funded, or numerous as the cult of hatred and warmongering and greed. But we know that the Jesus of the Gospel who commanded us to “Love thy neighbor as thyself” is not the Jesus of the State, and to throw one’s lot in with these politicians is to deliberately side with the legions of Hell.
I am heartbroken and ashamed at how many people I once thought good and decent, who have fallen for this lie and follow such a disgraceful monster.
The percent of US Christians and veterans who picked Cheeto exceed 60% both groups should properly classed as nazis and traitors.
I grew up Christian, and denounced it all at age 15 for atheism. Later, I ended up becoming very spiritual (but not religious, more like Taoist/Buddhist). That’s when I started to realize there are nuances like this.
Admittedly, I almost did write down Christian, but I changed it 'cause of exactly what you say. It isn’t fair to the actual Christ-like that exist out there, and it’s not only Christian denominations behaving this way.
It sucks that religion in general is being used by the vile controllers to manipulate, and I wish there were more folks like you that actually questioned things and lifted the veil for themselves. Seems to me that, at least southern baptists, are practically trained to never question authority and always take information at face value if the person giving that information simply claims they are Christian. Same people believe that you should keep sex and drug information from your children, instead of preparing them for the good and bad of each they may encounter in the world.
I am heartbroken and ashamed at how many people I once thought good and decent, who have fallen for this lie and follow such a disgraceful monster.
Yea… it especially sucks when its your parents. We used to do fun things together, now I have to hide everything about who I am.
As an American I’m not embarrassed. The whole world should have seen this coming. This country elected Trump in
2020EDIT: My mistake, Trump was elected in 2016. Americans showed you what type of time they’re on. When he lost re-election Americans tried to force his presidency. The Democrats were too weak while they had power, always trying to take the high road. If any country is still dumb enough to rely on the US for anything then they get what they get.EDIT 2: spell check
Trump did not get elected in 2020…he was elected 2016. Biden was elected 2020.
Have to correct because the craziest think he did win 2020.
Oh yeah, you are correct. I’ll fix it.
The Democrats were too weak while they had power
Don’t you think this attitude is the reason why you’re in this mess? Wanting a strong ruler rather than having politicians that follow the law and try to provide good government. If the Democrats were “strong” then you’d have a Democrat strongman and you’d still be in the same mess.
The Dems are weak. And it’s not because they follow the law because they don’t, just look at that NY City mayor. They follow the money, look at Pelosi. They aren’t a party for the common person but the loudest who might net them the most money. Mostly, they’re just like Republicans in the way they cling to power until their death. How many of them have died in power due to old age instead of stepping aside to let the young legislate the world they’re inheriting? They try to follow agreed upon rules, not laws, knowing the other party won’t follow those rules.
As an example, Obama had the opportunity to appoint 2 judges to the Supreme Court. Instead of appointing a judge after Scalia died he let the next president decide arrogantly thinking it would be Clinton. He also believe senator Graham when he stated that presidents shouldn’t appoint judges during election year. Everyone with a brain knew that was bullshit! You have the power to appoint judges so do it! The second SC judge he could have appointed would replace Ruth Bader Ginsburg but that also didn’t happen because she, a dem, couldn’t let go of power and retire. Instead she dies in office during Trump’s first term. That’s the term where he appoints a SC judge during an election year and Graham forgets what he said 4 years earlier.
Now where would we be now if Obama appointed 2 more judges before his term ended? Imagine what the Supreme Court would look like if Obama called Graham’s BS and RBG gave up power and retired like the old lady she was? It’s shit like this that convinces me that the Democratic Party is weak.
In a democracy you should strive for having strong people and weak politicians that do as the people want.
If you’re striving for having strongmen so you don’t have to do anything yourself, then you are being weak. And that’s why the US has gotten to be what it’s become: weak and lazy people looking for someone else to solve all of your problems. This is why Trump’s message of “vote fore me and you won’t need to vote ever again” resonates. You want someone to rule over you and figure out everything for you. This made the US ripe for a fascist takeover.
Even now you’re whining about someone else not solving your problems for you. Didn’t vote? That’s the democrats fault. To cowardly to discuss politics with your family? That’s the democrats fault.
In the end, you’re aligned with the fascists in your hatred of the opposition. It’s easier for you to sit back and complain about the opposition than to grow a spine and support the opposition regardless of what your family, peer group, or anyone else will think about for doing so.
Dude stop trying to put words in my mouth. I didn’t say any of that. I already explained why I thought the democrats were weak and it wasn’t for anything you just said. They are weak because they were trying to play by rules the other team clearly didn’t play by, they’re weak because they arrogantly thought they could keep power beyond their limit, they are weak because they stand for trends instead of standing with the people who vote for them and listening to their real problems. I can’t tell you how many times the democrats would come to my community begging for votes and making promises only to walk back on those promises and never come back until the next election promising to do it then.
I never said anything about anyone ruling over me or making decisions for me. I’ve never whined about anyone else not solving my problems. Where did you even get that? I never even mentioned discussing politics with family, which I do, so why did you just make up more shit to throw against me.
And finally you claim I’m aligned with fascist using the evidence you literally just made up. You are part of the problem. You don’t want to accept any criticism on the democrats but instead make up lies about what you claim I said or what you interpret. You don’t listen but you’ll use lies to discredit and silence me because I don’t agree with you.
Everything in that post you claimed I said or that I represent is not true. Stop making shit up.
And by “high road” you mean the one paved by donor money, not the morally high road.
Yes thats the one. I wasn’t clear but you are right.
Don’t be embarrassed for the actions of poloticians. We only have the illusion of choice in the US. You can be embarrassed for the human race if you like. Cause “leaders” like this exist in the first place.
Don’t be embarrassed for the actions of poloticians. We only have the illusion of choice in the US. You can be embarrassed for the human race if you like. Cause “leaders” like this exist in the first place.
We absolutely had a choice
This is definitely our punishment for elevating sociopathy to celebrity, rather than chasing it out into the dark woods with pointy sticks.
Personally I’m disgusted to be in the same country as the people who approve of this. Makes me fucking sick.
