I think people care.
They care so much they actively avoid them.
Even non tech people I talk to know AI is bad because the companies are pushing it so hard. They intuit that if the product was good, they wouldn’t be giving it away, much less begging you to use it.
You’re right - and even if the user is not conscious of this observation, many are subconsciously behaving in accordance with it. Having AI shoved into everything is offputting.
Speaking of off-putting, that friggin copilot logo floating around on my Word document is so annoying. And the menu that pops up when I paste text — wtf does “paste with Copilot” even mean?
They are trying to saturate the user base with the word copilot. At least microsoft isnt very sneaky about anything.
It’s partly that and partly a mad dash for market share in case the get it to work usefully. Although this is kind of pointless because AI isn’t very sticky. There’s not much to keep you from using another company’s AI service. And only the early adopter nerds are figuring out how to run it on their own hardware.
customers dont want AI, but only thhe corporation heads seem obssed with it.
No thanks. I’m perfectly capable of coming up with incorrect answers on my own.
you’re right tho
Nein!
Doch!
Ooh!
The only issue here is that there is no really useful ubiquitous feature yet. Once that comes, people will not care about any security issues or any other reason against it. It’s coming for sure. Maybe they need recall feature to train right now, maybe they won’t anymore at some point.
Lemmy people do not like your comment, but I think you are spot on. Laypeople just do not care about privacy, like, at all. That’s how instagram, facebook and such are popular despite all the privacy infractions.
It’s so sad how people 1000% prefer convenience over privacy…
Some people are really crazy around here and they will downvote anything and everything AI, especially posts from someone who might not be an anti-ai activist.
I’ve got my own view. I’ve worked in a company that does ai research and I’ve seen the how fast the progress is. I’m also old enough to remember vividly a time when people couldn’t imagine that anyone would put their entire life online for everyone else to see. Yet here we are.
ooh wow, the speed of progress. such a well known indicator of something definitely being good, and never at all being abused by ghouls!
sometimes I wonder if any of you dumb fuckwits ever read any historical perspectives at all
“so true bestie” says the dipshit, brushing under the carpet all the notes about overt efforts and capital expended by monopolist captive operators
At first I was skeptical of the guy who told me, but they seemed rich and therefore trustworthy.
You have a source for that? 😁
AI is going to be this eras Betamax, HD-Dvd, or 3d TV glasses. It doesn’t do what was promised and nobody gives a shit.
Betamax actually found use in Television broadcast until the switch to HDTV occurred in 2009
the later digital variants of beta weren’t retired by sony until ~ 2016.
I had no clue that they did digital betamax…
That would make senes though…
There was at one point an HDVHS as well it was essentially a 1080P MPEG stream on a VHS tape
I was just about to mention porn and how each new format of the past came down to that very same factor.
If AI computers were incredible at making AI porn I bet you they’d be selling a lot better hahaNo, I’m sorry. It is very useful and isn’t going away. This threads is either full of Luddites or disingenuous people.
@blarth @TheThrillOfTime huh. You totally name at least one use case then, huh
You only didn’t because it’s so blindingly obvious(It’s BS)
Also, learn about Luddites, mannobody asked you to post in this thread. you came and posted this shit in here because the thread is very popular, because lots and lots of people correctly fucking hate generative AI
so I guess please enjoy being the only “non-disingenuous” bootlicker you know outside of work, where everyone’s required (under implicit threat to their livelihood) to love this shitty fucking technology
but most of all: don’t fucking come back, none of us Luddites need your mid ass
Betamax had better image and sound, but was limited by running time and then VHS doubled down with even lower quality to increase how many hours would fit on a tape. VHS was simply more convenient without being that much lower quality for normal tape length.
HD-DVD was comparable to BluRay and just happened to lose out because the industry won’t allow two similar technologies to exist at the same time.
Neither failed to do what they promised. They were both perfectly fine technologies that lost in a competition that only allows a single winner.
BluRay was slightly better if I recall correctly. With the rise in higher definition televisions, people wanted to max out the quality possible, even if most people (still) can’t tell the difference
Not just that, space. BluRays have way more space than DVD’s. Remember how many 360 games came with multiple discs? Not a single PS3 game did, unless it was a bonus behind the scenes type thing.
Xbox 360 used DVDs for game discs and could play video DVDs. They “supported” HDDVDs - you needed an addon which had a separate optical drive in it. Unsurprisingly this didn’t sell well.
Blu-ray also had the advantage of PS3 supporting the format without the need for an external disc drive.
Blue ray also had the advantage of not having multiple D’s in its name.
@philycheeze @xkbx yes, I think Microslop’s fumble of selling the HD DVD drive only as an external add-on really hindered the format
@philycheeze @xkbx I bought one anyway. 10 years later, mind you :p
They’re not necessarily bad, it’s just an extra barrier to entry.
Nah Blu-ray was significantly better, 50gb capacity vs 30gb
The big plus for HD DVD was it was far cheaper to produce, it didn’t need massive retooling for manufacturing.
That’s not why it won, though. It won because the industry wanted zone restrictions, which only Blu-Ray supported. They suck for the user, but allows the industry to stagger releases in different markets. In reality it just means that I can’t get discs of most foreign films, because they won’t work in my player.
I’m sure that was a factor, but Blu-ray won because the most popular Blu-ray player practically sold itself
It’s hard to say what was the final nail in the coffin, but it is true that Blu-Ray went from underdog to outselling HD-DVD around the time the PlayStation 3 came out. I’m not sure how much those early sales numbers matter, though, because I’m sure both were still miniscule compared to DVD.
When 20th Century Fox dropped support for HD-DVD, they cited superior copy protection as the reason. Lionsgate gave similar sentiment.
When Warner later announced they were dropping HD-DVD, they did cite customer adoption as the reason for their choice, but they also did it right before CES, so I’m pretty sure there were some backroom deals at play as well.
I think the biggest impact of the PlayStation 3 was accelerating adoption of Blu-Ray over DVD. Back when DVD came out, VHS remained a major player for years, until the year there was a DVD player so dirt cheap that everyone who didn’t already have a player got one for Christmas.
Afaik betamax did not have any porn content, which might have contributed to the sale of VHS systems.
Dude don’t throw Betamax in there, that was a better product than the VHS. AI is just ass.
One of the mistakes they made with AI was introducing it before it was ready (I’m making a generous assumption by suggesting that “ready” is even possible). It will be extremely difficult for any AI product to shake the reputation that AI is half-baked and makes absurd, nonsensical mistakes.
This is a great example of capitalism working against itself. Investors want a return on their investment now, and advertisers/salespeople made unrealistic claims. AI simply isn’t ready for prime time. Now they’ll be fighting a bad reputation for years. Because of the situation tech companies created for themselves, getting users to trust AI will be an uphill battle.
Apple Intelligence and the first versions of Gemini are the perfect examples of this.
iOS still doesn’t do what was sold in the ads, almost a full year later.
Insert ‘Full Self Driving’ Here.
Calling it “Full Self Driving” is such blatant false advertising.
Apple Intelligence and the first versions of Gemini are the perfect examples of this.
Add Amazon’s Alexa+ to that list. It’s nearly a year overdue and still nowhere in sight.
capitalism working against itself
More like: capitalism reaching its own logical conclusion
(I’m making a generous assumption by suggesting that “ready” is even possible)
It was ready for some specific purposes but it is being jammed into everything. The problem is they are marketing it as AGI when it is still at the random fun but not expected to be accurate phase.
The current marketing for AI won’t apply to anything that meets the marketing in the foreseeable future. The desired complexity isn’t going to exist in silicone at a reasonable scale.
The battle is easy. Buy out and collude with the competition so the customer has no choice but to purchase a AI device.
This would only work for a service that customers want or need
Ah, like with the TPM blackbox?
I’m making a generous assumption by suggesting that “ready” is even possible
To be honest it feels more and more like this is simply not possible, especially regarding the chatbots. Under those are LLMs, which are built by training neural networks, and for the pudding to stick there absolutely needs to have this emergent magic going on where sense spontaneously generates. Because any entity lining up words into sentences will charm unsuspecting folks horribly efficiently, it’s easy to be fooled into believing it’s happened. But whenever in a moment of despair I try and get Copilot to do any sort of task, it becomes abundantly clear it’s unable to reliably respect any form of requirement or directive. It just regurgitates some word soup loosely connected to whatever I’m rambling about. LLMs have been shoehorned into an ill-fitted use case. Its sole proven usefulness so far is fraud.
There was research showing that every linear jump in capabilities needed exponentially more data fed into the models, so seems likely it isn’t going to be possible to get where they want to go.
OpenAI admitted that with o1! they included graphs directly showing gains taking exponential effort
do you have any articles on this? i have heard this claim quite a few times, but im wondering how they put numbers on the capabilities of those models.
Yeah but first to market is sooooo good for stock price. Then you can sell at the top and gtfo before people find out it’s trash
I they didn’t over promise, they wouldn’t have had mountain loads of money to burn, so they wouldn’t have advanced the technology as much.
Tech giants can’t wait decades until the technology is ready, they want their VC money now.
Sure, but if the tech in the end doesn’t deliver it’s all that money burnt.
If it does deliver it’s still oligarchs deciding what tech we get.
Yes. The ones that have power are the ones that decide. And oligarchs by definition have a lot of power.
Google, Apple, Microsoft, Nvidia and everyone else is hyping up AI. Consumers are not really seeing much benefit by making everything AI-ified. Executives are raving over it but maybe aren’t realize that people outside of the C-suite aren’t that excited? Having it shoved in our faces constantly, or crammed in places companies hope they can save money is not helping either.
It’s FOMO amplified by capitalistic competition. No company wants to be the one left behind. I guarantee Google, Meta and even OpenAI know the limitations of their products. They don’t care, they just want to be at least as good as their competitors, because they assume at some point one of them will reach “good enough.” And at that moment, if they’re not in position to grab market share, they’ll lose a once-in-a-generation chance for billions or trillions of dollars in value.
We’re the casualties, because the people in the middle - companies with no AI but whose C-suite buys into the hype - demand we use unworkable products because they’re too willfully ignorant to know they’re not panaceas to whatever is bothering those C-suite execs at the moment.
Quarterly Driven Development
Google, Facebook, etc. have been burning money to gain market share and “good will” from users knowing that when the money faucet stopped or if they found a way to make money, they’d abuse their market share and squeeze their users for profit.
Once interest rates increased and the VC infinite money glitch went away (borrow at low interest rates, gamble on companies, repeat), the masks came off and the screws started turning, hard. Anything they can do to monetize anyone else involved, they’re trying.
The same story has been happening with AI but without the infinite money glitch - just investors desperate for a good bet getting hyped to hell and back. They need adoption and they need business to become dependent on their product. Each of these companies are basically billions in the hole on AI.
Users, especially technical users, should know that not only is the product failing to live up to the hype but that embracing AI is basically turning the other cheek for these companies to have their way with your wallet even faster and more aggressively than they already are with everything else they’ve given away.
Ai bro here. The reason there shit aint selling is because its useless for any actual ai aplication. Ai runs on gpus even an ai cpu will be so much slower than what an nvidea gpu can do. Of course no one buys it. Nvideas gpus still sell very well, and not just because of the gamers.
A lot of these systems are silly because they don’t have a lot of RAM and things don’t begin to get interesting with LLMs until you can run 70B and above
The Mac Studio has seemed an affordable way to achieve running 200B+ models mainly due to the unified memory architecture (compare getting 512GB of RAM in a Mac Studio to building a machine with enough GPU to get there)
If you look the industry in general is starting to move towards that sort of design now
The framework desktop for instance can be configured with 128GB of RAM ($2k) and should be good for handling 70B models while maintaining something that looks like efficiency.
You will not train, or refine models with these setups (I think you would still benefit from the raw power GPUs offer) but the main sticking point in running local models has been VRAM and how much it costs to get that from AMD / Nvidia
ah yes the only way to make LLMs, a technology built on plagiarism with no known use case, “not silly” is to throw a shitload of money at Apple or framework or whichever vendor decided to sell pickaxes this time for more RAM. yes, very interesting, thank you, fuck off
Built on copyright infringement, not plagarism (the data scientists that built them aren’t going around pretending all the training content was their ideation/creation). There are so many NLP tasks and areas of research that have been wholly obsoleted due to LLMs including sentiment analysis, summarization, translation, NER, data extraction, etc., so I find the “no known use case” to be rather ignorant. The first consumer computers also had tremendous costs. Paradigm shifts in technology are never cheap until scaling.
I think this comment is unfair toward @cubism_pitta@lemmy.world and you should reflect a bit on why that is.
soz kid, you’re definitely not tall enough for this ride. maybe go over to the back there and have a lollipop
Bro, you could wear my dick as a luxuriously thick mustache without getting on your tippy toes. If I’m not tall enough, you definitely aren’t.
Also, if you’re handing out free candy, are you sure you’re allowed to be this close to a school? Just because you paid incogni to take down your mugshot doesn’t mean you aren’t still a registered sex offender.
Enclosed please find one (1) complimentary ticket to the egress.
LOL. I checked the modlog. Man, the monocle fell off that sealion real quick.
lol
also you’re right, I was unfair towards cubism_pitta. I wasn’t enough of an asshole.
hey fuckers. next time you get the sudden, overwhelming urge to jack off in public about how much money you’re feeding into the machine that does plagiarism and nothing else, keep it the fuck off my instance.
OK, I will reflect on why you think that comment was unfair.
okwhateverdude
ah yes the only way to make LLMs, a technology built on plagiarism with no known use case, “useful for any actual ai application” is to throw a shitload of money at nvidia. weird how that works!
Can the NPU be used for practical purposes other than generative AI? If not, I don’t need it.
It depends on how broad you are with the definition. There are a lot of uses for an NPU that aren’t hosting your own chatgpt analog.
list them, as far as I can tell NPUs are shitty cut-down GPUs with a few functions much slower
You are right that they are effectively limited use GPUs, but that doesn’t make them useless. That’s really the point, I’d agree it is a weird fit for laptops though.
My personal interest is object detection / facial recognition which is a function a lot of AIs have, but you may or may not classify it as ‘Generative AI’ on it’s own.
you may or may not classify it as ‘Generative AI’ on it’s own.
while the ship has sailed on calling the opencv shit you’re doing AI (thx, grifters of the first AI bubble), which part of object detection and facial recognition is generative?
How did this thread blow up so much?
sometimes a thread breaks containment, the “all” algorithm feeds it to even more people, and we see that Lemmy really does replace Reddit
What is even the point of an AI coprocessor for an end user (excluding ML devs)? Most of the AI features run in the cloud and even if they could run locally, companies are very happy to ask you rent for services and keep you vendor locked in.
These “AI Computers” are a solution looking for a problem. The marketing people naming these “AI” computers think that AI is just some magic fairy dust term you can add to a product and it will increase demand.
What’s the “killer features” of these new laptops, and what % price increase is it worth?
What’s the “killer features” of these new laptops
LLM
and what % price increase is it worth?
negative eighty, tops
Please stop shoving ai into everything,please give us opt out from AI icons and stuff /srs
even better: opt-in, over opt-out
none of these fuckers want to go for that, because it’d make their darling shitpile look oh so bad
but it’s also a stark thing: ~20y ago tech actually asked first, and (mostly) fucked off if you told it to
the way a lot of tech companies approach consent (and how users have been primed following that) right now is some mad toxic fucked up bullshit
Yep
